i saw a john ankerberg show where lorri macgregor said this book was to be burned.
i don't think it was official but the book does have damning evidence about the 1925 debacle in it when i made an effort to find a copy.
(most copies go for $400 or more on the internet).
Rocketman... the book was by Van Amburgh, a JW. (He was one of the seven directors imprisoned in 1918.) Lorri MacGregor claimed, on Ankerberg's show, that the Society wanted copies of this book burned, to cover up their false prophecies.
Personally, I've never known of the Society going so far as to order their old books burned. So I am highly dubious of that claim. But the book is certainly an excellent example of failed WTS prophecy!
let me start out by saying that i would like nothing better than to see the society totally disappear one day and lose its controlling grip upon its members.
this forum is probably one of the most frequented sites for doubting jws and lurkers so i think it is important to be as skilled at combating the witnesses as is possible.
not every argument made against someone or something is a good one.
Six... I certainly agree with you that there's value in recounting those experiences.
What I think logansrun is objecting to--at least, what I object to--is the attempt to generalize these experiences as if they were representative of all JWs. I've heard people say, for example, that all elders are uneducated assholes, that all pioneers are unemployed welchers, that all elders' wives are nosy gossips, etc. Personally, that sort of stereotyping is what I object to, and I agree with logan that its counterproductive to presenting the truth about the truth.
As a side note, I can't help noting that Logan felt obligated to justify pointing out logical fallacies, by showing that it actually works to improve our efforts against the WTS in the long run. As if truth needed any justification. Not that I'm blaming Logan... but if he hadn't included the disclaimer, and hadbeen attacked as a pro-WTS apologist, that would have been a pretty sad demonstration of groupthink.
i used to be a ms and stepped aside because i could not stand the wrong teachings (chronology, annointed etc.
) and the high pressure they worked unto people anymore.
when i stepped aside i also stopped going to the meetings and doing field service.. on the other hand, when i was in i was always longing for "privileges".
Little Toe's link is down due to lack of bandwidth. Does anyone else have some spare webspace they could use to host it? I'd gladly offer, but my domain name has my full name in it, so that would kind of blow my cover...
Before I read Crisis of Conscience I wanted to try to become an elder; I didn't have any fantasies that I could change the organization, but I thought that I could at least be an influence in my local congregation. After reading CoC, I realized that I was in denial, and that the plan was futile.
let me start out by saying that i would like nothing better than to see the society totally disappear one day and lose its controlling grip upon its members.
this forum is probably one of the most frequented sites for doubting jws and lurkers so i think it is important to be as skilled at combating the witnesses as is possible.
not every argument made against someone or something is a good one.
Great post, logansrun. I look forward to the continuation of the series.
finding googlewhacks.. your goal: find that elusive query (two words - no quote marks) with a single, solitary result!.
1. your two googlefactors must exist in this dictionary.
it's so easy to confirm: google does the work!
This is harder than it looks! Who would have guessed that 'septic iguana' and 'soporific particularism' would have turned up so many hits? Even 'Parthian telekinesis' got four. I thought I had hit pay-dirt with 'Parthian sarsaparilla', but that turned out to be a word-list.
After considerable more exploration of the Parthian empire, I finally scored with:
parthian summersault
i was 13 at the time.
i wanted to get baptised before the end came in 1975. .
back then, 13 was borderline young for baptism, but from what i've been reading, some are now getting baptised as young as 9 or 10. .
LOL @ Mizpah!
I'm with cruzan and coffee here... I was baptized at 8.
Even most witnesses thought I was too young. My father was the PO, however, so the elders went ahead and did the questions with me, and I could answer them all with no trouble. So they let me get dunked.
There was definitely some competitiveness involved. My older brother had also gotten baptized when he was 8, so I had to at least match him! I wanted to get baptized when I was 7, but my parents wouldn't let me. I was still happy that I beat my brother by six months.
Mainly, though, I wanted to "make progress." I wanted to get "privileges", I wanted the respect of adults, etc. And of course, the thought of doubting whether it was the truth had never even crossed my mind at that age.
.
sorry, i don't have the technical ability to manipulate this comic but this is what i thought when i read it yesterday.. look what one of the brothers said to a reporter.. "our policy on handling child sexual abuse in our organization is putrid.
but we compensate by ignoring complaints.".
LOL Sad, but true.
Today's works too... just replace "products" with "child abuse policies" and "divining rod" with "judicial committee"...
.
what kind of an example are we setting for young witness girls regarding modesty?
i personally think she looks nice, although maybe she should try for some darker colors; but because of her jw affiliation, it justs makes one stagger at the double standards.
I'm going to agree with m0nk3y here. I mean, really, how is this "double standards"? The Williams girls are probably irregular if not inactive. Do you think that the elders would chase down a couple of irregular/inactive girls who rarely even attend meetings to counsel them about their dress? I haven't known any elders that bad.
hallo everyone.
the earlier thread about the min school reminded me of the number of times that i researched and at least partly put together items and pub talks for 'he must be obeyed'.. this was necessary because he worked full time in a demanding job which left very little leeway for cobbling the many assignments together.
at first being a good dub wife i felt guilty at doing this but in talking to others whose husbands also worked full time and were not part time cleaners or window cleaners i found that several other elders wives had always done this.. not only the talks but also sorting out the school assigments, the schedules, field service arrangements, sorting the auditing, coach and accomodation for the dc and ca, checking the accounts etc.. lots of these sisters also helped their children put together their items.. rather makes a mockery of the male privilege of "taking the lead".. most elders and ms are unable to cope with all the pressures and work if their wives dont do most for them.
I believe the socio-economic status of the elder depends on whether he developed any skills before entering the truth.
Or the status of their parents. The ones I mentioned above, who are a photographer and a businessman, were raised as Witnesses.
You can't tell me you've known an elder or a pioneer going to night school.
I've known of several young people pioneering while going to college. I have a good friend who had a part-time job opportunity that required a Masters, so she got the degree, got the job, and started pioneering.
I agree, however, eldering or pioneering, however, doesn't allow a person time to pursue continuing education while supporting a family.
An entrepeneur who enters the truth is a rare thing. A JW who becomes an entrepeneur while in the truth is almost impossible.
Let's see. My father started several succesful business of his own as a JW elder. I know several brothers who've established consulting practices after becoming JWs. And of course, you have the local cleaning moguls.
The fact is, the economic reality of being a JW depends heavily on the territory of the congregation. I just don't think you can make broad stereotypes.
my jw father felt the need to leave this new publication at my house.
lucky me!
i was leafing through it, and noticed a quote on page 155 about birthday celebrations.
So they weren't even actually quoting the Catholic Encyclopedia... they were quoting Origen.
Why the heck are they quoting academic sources in a book for kids, anyway?
