SECRECY, Pros and Cons...UBM's, I'm asking you (page 4)

carla

Vitty,

I'm not saying it is totally unbearable.We still do things together. But see what CYP said above. There are now three people involved (or the whole cong, see many posts on the gossip problem) How anyone could read all the human wreckage stories, the wt's and thier views about anyone who doesn't follow along like sheep to a slaughter, the child abuse problems, the sexual abuse problems, the immoral activities that go on at the halls and tintillate the whole cong, the jc meetings, they hypocrisy, the suicides, etc..etc... and not be horrified that your spouse of many, many years has joined this evil cult, I just don't know! To me it is just pure evil. How can any intelligent person believe any of it?! that is rhetorical. You just can't believe how your spouse could join such an org.! It is so hard to understand when even the slightest bit of research will show the falseness of it. You watch on in horror as they suck the life out of your loved one. And relationships that are destroyed in the process don't even seem to bother the jw, they use God as an excuse to justify anything. Only they don't realize that it isn't God but a publishing company filled with evil people in New York out for the almighty buck$ they change personalities, that's what cults do.

kiddotan

thank you for this, only a couple of years into my relationship. Finding amazing lot of answers here.

Pardon my ignorance (which is bliss most of the time), what is this book C of C. Find reference on so many threads, keep looking back and not finding it anywhere. Is it worth me reading?

vitty

CoC is essential reading !!

jgnat

kiddotan, "Crisis of Conscience" (CoC) is essential reading for exiting Jehovah's Witnesses.

http://www.freeminds.org/sales/books.htm#crisis

For "unbelieving mates" (UBM's), CoC does not have the same powerful effect. I recommend Steve Hassan's "Releasing the Bonds: Empowering People to Think for Themselves."

http://www.freedomofmind.com/

ithinkisee

Are you open with your partner about your participation on this board?
Prior to telling her everything ... absolutely not. She would have cut me off with no problems.

Do you hide your reference materials from your partner?
Yes, I absolutely hid everything and only let her see what I wanted her to see so as not to trigger the JW "thought-stopping" techniques.
Have you had any close calls, and if so, describe them?
There were a couple of times I had JWD open and she was walking towards my laptop and I wasn't sure I would close everything in time.
If you are secretive about your anti-JW activities, do you plan on coming clean with your partner at some time? I have come clean. At this point there is nothing she doesn't know about my anti-JW research - except for maybe that I researched so much that there is some I haven't told her. But the way she researches she has probably found out alot of that stuff herself.
If you do plan on coming clean, when do you anticipate doing so? n/a
If your partner is aware of your anti-JW activity, how do they react?
Now that she knows, you can ask her ... her name on here is FreedomLover
Any stories to share?
I have posted pretty much everything on here.

-ithinkisee

ithinkisee

Apostate books are written by Satan in their eyes. This all then speaks to the need for some level of secrecy. You can't overtly say that you are trying to help steer them out of the org and expect them to trust you in any way.

Even though my wife was as good as "out" of the Org at one point, I NEVER offered her CoC or Christian Freedom or Gentile Times books until she SAID OUT LOUD: " I want to get the Gentile Times book." or "I would like to read one of Franz's books."

During times of doubt in the future (which can likely happen) I do not want her to look back and even BEGIN to think I pushed the "apostate" literature on her in ANY way.

-ithinkisee

jgnat

Ithinkisee, I am honored that you visited my thread. Your viewpoint is important, since yours is a success story. This made me laugh, it gives me the greatest imagery. The mouse flying, the face rigid in a rictus of innocence:

There were a couple of times I had JWD open and she was walking towards my laptop and I wasn't sure I would close everything in time.

jgnat

The NOT PUSHING, an important concept, ithinkisee. This is the catch-22 of the UBM world. It is so important to honor the free will of our partners to choose their faith. It is so hard to watch though, as the WTBTS shamelessly uses every manipulative trick in the book to coerce my partner in to joining then staying, knowing that it would be unethical to use the same techniques. There are times I have stood by and SUPPORTED my husband's decision to get MORE INVOLVED. Very painful.

In the long view, though, I think it must be the only way. If hubby ever independently breaks away in the future, it has to be because he wants to.

freedomlover

Are you open with your partner about your participation on this board?

Prior to telling her everything ... absolutely not. She would have cut me off with no problems.

FL- that is probably true...it would have totally made me think he was Satan himself!
Do you hide your reference materials from your partner?

Yes, I absolutely hid everything and only let her see what I wanted her to see so as not to trigger the JW "thought-stopping" techniques.

FL - ITIS did leave certain things laying around -like info. on Jerusalem's fall - but I have to say, the first time I saw that info. I got an immediate pit in my stomach and I said to myself, "Well, my husband is an apostate!" I was mortified. It's amazing to me now how fast my mind was trained to think of "turning him in." Makes me sick now.
Have you had any close calls, and if so, describe them?

There were a couple of times I had JWD open and she was walking towards my laptop and I wasn't sure I would close everything in time.

FL - Yes, I did know something was up. I would walk over and he's be fumbling around on the computer and I'd be asking him a question and he'd be stuttering around..."What? What? " I figured he must be a porn addict or something!
If you are secretive about your anti-JW activities, do you plan on coming clean with your partner at some time? I have come clean. At this point there is nothing she doesn't know about my anti-JW research - except for maybe that I researched so much that there is some I haven't told her. But the way she researches she has probably found out alot of that stuff herself.
FL - We are very open about everything now, but I am actually getting a taste of the sneaking around with info. thing now. Whenever someone drops by (JW's) I have to quickly scan the house to make sure I've put all my info. and books away. It's very hard to live like that! I still am hiding all my Ray Franz books in case someone drops by, or if my kids friends spot it and tell their parents.
If you do plan on coming clean, when do you anticipate doing so? n/a

FL- There are a few close friends and family members that will demand to know what is wrong with me when I finally stop doing the JW thing. I will stop all JW activites when we move out of state, which will be pretty soon. There will still be those who stay in touch and I"m still trying to figure out how to handle that.....
If your partner is aware of your anti-JW activity, how do they react?

Now that she knows, you can ask her ... her name on here is FreedomLover

FL - I don't know if this helps in any way, but for over a year ITIS would drop hints, plant seeds, etc. I remember him planting seeds one time about a year ago about how he read an article about voting, and then one aobout luai's (sp? Hawaiian parties) and how the WT said basically it was up to the individuals to handle those situations. The Luai one said that even though it had pagan origins people didn't connect the celebration with those origins anymore so it would probably be okay to do it. What!? Christmas IS NOT celebrated for those exact reasons! I was more annoyed than anything when he started doing this seed planting. I knew in my gut there was something more going on, and in his true to fashion way of NEVER communicating with me, he just dropped hints instead of REALLY saying what was on his mind. Honestly, it thoroughly pissed me off! I recently did a personality test and it said that I am very high on the end of wanting things out in the open and then decide on issues. My personality is not one to have lots of open ended possibilities floating around. So I don't know if it's just my personality as to why ITIS's hint dropping was so annoying or if it is like that for most BM's. LIke I said before - I was in a way relieved when ITIS finally spilled his guts. At least then, I knew what the heck was going on with him and then we could decide things out, instead of living in limbo. Even if that eventual decision was a divorce, at least we knew where we both stood.
Any stories to share? FL - you can read my story if you want anymore backround info.

twinflame

Glad things worked out good for you FL. I was interested in this comment of yours

and then one aobout luai's (sp? Hawaiian parties) and how the WT said basically it was up to the individuals to handle those situations. The Luai one said that even though it had pagan origins people didn't connect the celebration with those origins anymore so it would probably be okay to do it.

This blows me away too. Do you know where that information is?

Thanks,

TF

SECRECY, Pros and Cons...UBM's, I'm asking you

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