Witchcraft - Would you use it?

by Sirona 106 Replies latest jw friends

  • daystar
    daystar

    Thanks for posting that. It reminds me of something.

    Aristotle, bless him, gave the West logic. His Law of the Excluded Middle especially. This says that something either IS or it IS NOT. It cannot be BOTH.

    The East never had Aristotle. They developed without logic.

    The result is interesting on a lot of levels.

    The WEST developed Science and with Science; technology, advancement and prosperity.

    The EAST did not. They developed RELIGIONs which kept them in a kind of "enlightened" poverty.

    When the WEST embraces religion it tosses Aristotle out the window.

    Most ridiculous rituals are very non-Aristotelian. But, very compatible with EASTERN non-logic.

    True enough, in a way, Mr. Spock. And I can imagine you don't have much respect for so-called Fuzzy Logic? However, fuzzy logic systems seem to me to bear much closer resemblance to the way we humans really think, as opposed to binary logic systems where a thing is either 0 or 1.

    From my perspective, I see that a thing can Be and Not Be at the same time. And from what little I know of quantum states, this would seem to be the case at that level as well.

    However, one of the most interesting things to me about being human is that no matter what one chooses to believe about anything, the Universe tends to produce evidence to support that.

  • Shawn10538
    Shawn10538

    I am a Wiccan but I don't believe in spells and the nonsense of the religion. There is no doctrine in Wicca, there is only living by the Rede that matters. I know many of my friends who commune with the dead, or claim to, but the practices of a witch are as varied as the people claim to be Wiccan. That's one of the things I like about it. I am not forced to believe in anything at all. "If it harms none, then do what you will."

    Shawn

  • Shawn10538
    Shawn10538

    It's ridiculous to say that the east developed without logic. One cannot even take a step without using logic. If A then B type thinking is witnessed in infants around the world. Besides, there are many different kinds and styles of logic. Aritotiliam logic is just one kind of logic. Without logic the east would nort have been able to build structures, have irrigation or any of the other advancements they had. There are many famous methematicians from Persia and Saudi Arabia in particular, many of whom preceded Aristotle. I personally did a report on a persian arab mathmatician from the 800s but I forgot his name. Muhammed something or other. Yeah, they had logic, lots of it.

  • Terry
    Terry
    It's ridiculous to say that the east developed without logic. One cannot even take a step without using logic. If A then B type thinking is witnessed in infants around the world. Besides, there are many different kinds and styles of logic. Aritotiliam logic is just one kind of logic. Without logic the east would nort have been able to build structures, have irrigation or any of the other advancements they had. There are many famous methematicians from Persia and Saudi Arabia in particular, many of whom preceded Aristotle. I personally did a report on a persian arab mathmatician from the 800s but I forgot his name. Muhammed something or other. Yeah, they had logic, lots of it.

    Eastern religion and philosophy are without logic. They are mystical. They pull it out of their behind.

    The statement I made was not an absolutist comment.

    There are not many different kinds and styles of logic. Logic is the art of non-contradictory measurement. Aristotelian logic was the mother tongue from which math, science and technology got their start.

    I'd love to see you give an example of Persian and Saudi Arabian "logic" which did not stem from Aristotle.

    Are you aware that at one time the Arabs (hence Muslims) discovered buried manuscripts of Aristotle and began a Renaissance of learning which propelled them forward in thinking, analytical reasoning and progress? Then, the theologians stifled and smothered it altogether.

    The mathematician you refere to was Al Jabr from which we get the term Algebra.

    In Arabic, Aristotle was referred to by name as Aristutalis or, more frequently, Aristu, although when quoted he was often referred to by a sobriquet such as 'the wise man'. Aristotle was also generally known as the First Teacher. Following the initial reception of Hellenistic texts into Islamic thought in al-Kindi's time, al-Farabi rediscovered a 'purer' version in the tenth century. In an allusion to his dependence on Aristotle, al-Farabi was called the Second Teacher. Ibn Rushd, known in the West as Averroes, was the last great Arabophone commentator on Aristotle, writing numerous treatises on his works. A careful examination of the Aristotelian works received by the Arabs indicates they were generally aware of the true Aristotle. Later, transmission of these works to Christian Europe allowed Aristotelianism to flourish in the scholastic period.
    Aristotelianism
    After the decline of Rome, Aristotle’s work was lost in the West. However, in the 9th cent., Arab scholars introduced Aristotle to Islam, and Muslim theology, philosophy, and natural science all took on an Aristotelian cast. It was largely through Arab and Jewish scholars that Aristotelian thought was reintroduced in the West. His works became the basis of medieval scholasticism; much of Roman Catholic theology shows, through St. Thomas Aquinas, Aristotelian influence. There has also been a revival of Aristotelian influence on philosophy in the 20th cent. His teleological approach has continued to be central to biology, but it was banished from physics by the scientific revolution of the 17th cent. His work in astronomy, later elaborated by Ptolemy, was controverted by the investigations of Copernicus and Galileo.
  • Sirona
    Sirona
    Next, make up a really silly ritual such as rubbing an egg on your crotch and belching three times while saying aloud: TAILS, TAILS, TAILS

    Terry,

    OK so you are trying to make a point. However it really pisses me off when people decide to dub other people's religious practices as "silly". To you it appears to be silly and you're entitled to your opinion. However, the example you gave was TOTALLY OFF THE MARK anyway and proves that you don't actually understand the nature of ritual or so called spellwork.

    Sirona

  • funkyderek
    funkyderek

    Sirona:

    However, the example you gave was TOTALLY OFF THE MARK anyway and proves that you don't actually understand the nature of ritual or so called spellwork.

    I don't quite understand them either. If someone wanted to test whether the claims of witchcraft/paganism/Wicca were actually true, what would be a useful method? To me, Terry's method seems reasonable. If the spell/ritual (forgive me if I use inappropriate terminology) has even a small influence then the number of "tails" observed should be consistently above 50. Is there any reason why this test wouldn't work? Can you think of a test that would work better?

  • daystar
    daystar

    You know what? I think Terry's challenge is perfectly reasonable.

    Without lust of results, I suggest a believer perform this experiment. Now, a good practitioner should already be keeping at least two journals, one being a dream journal and the other being a ritual log, right?

    For 100 days, perform a simple ritual with measurable results. Log it all and return with the results.

    I'm not going to do it because I don't perform "spells" like this, my personal experience and opinion being that Terry is mostly correct on this level. (I'm much more interested in programming.)

  • stillajwexelder
    stillajwexelder

    Hey Funkyderek - as I said earlier in the thread tongue in cheek , if wicca/witchcraft can be proven to get me laid more often, I would practice it

  • reneeisorym
    reneeisorym

    I talked to a psychic once and everything she said came true. Funny thing was that I didn't even believe what she was telling me at the time. In '05 She said that I was going to get married in '07 and I remember thinking, "there's no way it can be later than '06! We are already so serious now! ... and here I am. Now I've got a few more years until that family comes along that she promised me .. LOL

    I still stay away from that stuff. It has something to do with the upbringing. I had to try it once though.

  • daystar
    daystar
    if wicca/witchcraft can be proven to get me laid more often, I would practice it

    You've never heard of the "Sacred Rite", have you? When one of a religion's highest ceremonies involves sex, how can you not increase the odds? (Then there is sex magick, tantra, etc.)

    Pagans/wiccans/occultists in general don't tend to subscribe to the repressive sexual doctrines so many other religions do.

    So... should we reserve a place for you in circle?

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit