I guess we can forgive Gopher his very occasional bit of hyperbole.
BTS
Hyperbole? Gopher?
Oxymoron non pareil!
Sylvia
President Obama and a Democrat Congress Will....
by owenfieldreams 143 Replies latest jw friends
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snowbird
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Gopher
Bush has run a ruthless presidency, with the middle and lower classes taking the brunt. He has thousands of kids dying and getting maimed for him in Iraq, for what purpose only he seems to know.
He enacted $2 trillion of tax cuts for wealthier Americans, an act that even John McCain despised when he wasn't being so political. At the same time, billions of dollars were being eliminated for environmental protection, food disbursements, birth control programs and benefits for the unemployed.
Bush stood by while Enron made huge money for its leaders and shareholders dishonestly while its actions were causing an energy crisis in California 5-6 years ago. He and his administration stood by while mortgage lenders, unregulated, were making huge profits and unrealistically inflating the housing / real estate bubble. Now that bird has come home to roost, and it's ruining the American economy. NOW they finally decide it's time to regulate the mortgage industry. I guess your laissez-faire approach didn't work so well, huh, Mr. President?
The Pentagon and Homeland Security divisions got a budget increase to about half a trillion dollars, while spending for education, infrastructure and health care was frozen somewhere around $350 billion. The America in which I grew up, the America I knew, used to invest in its people, knowing there would be a payoff in productivity and competitiveness later.
Recent American leadership seems to be short-sighted and beholden to the wealthy and influential. The middle-class which made America great is in notable decline.
Add to all that the unconstitutional favoritism of government towards the majority religion, which has been enlarged by the current administration. They conduct "days of prayer" which are aimed at pleasing the majority religious group. The government funnels money towards faith-based programs, and in that way favors certain belief systems over others. How does that make sense in an era where money is supposed to be tight?
There's less freedom of speech for dissenters. People's telephones are being tapped with no warrant. It's supposedly to increase security, but if you believe that -- you have no idea what the phrase "Big Brother" means. If you're a Green party member or an anti-war protestor, your name is quite likely to be on a watch list. "First amendment zones" are created for any anti-Bush protestors, and police cameras are trained on those zones.
I love America and the ideals it stands for. I don't love that it's drifting away from egalitarianism and freedom for its people.
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BurnTheShips
He enacted $2 trillion of tax cuts for wealthier Americans, an act that even John McCain despised when he wasn't being so political. At the same time, billions of dollars were being eliminated for environmental protection, food disbursements, birth control programs and benefits for the unemployed.
I got my tax cut too!! I am a working man. Being that the top quintile was paying for 80% of the taxes (and does a third of the labor), the top 1% pays 29% of all taxes, and the top 5% pays 50% of the taxes, I think the cut was very egalitarian. Egalitarian means equal. That was not progressive taxation, it was confiscatory taxation.
Bush stood by while Enron made huge money for its leaders and shareholders dishonestly while its actions were causing an energy crisis in California 5-6 years ago.
Enron was acting dishonestly during the 90's, buddy. The bastards were tried before court during the Bush presidency. But really, we can't praise Bush for that can we? We have an independent system of courts, remember?
He and his administration stood by while mortgage lenders, unregulated, were making huge profits and unrealistically inflating the housing / real estate bubble. Now that bird has come home to roost, and it's ruining the American economy. NOW they finally decide it's time to regulate the mortgage industry. I guess your laissez-faire approach didn't work so well, huh, Mr. President?
The banking/lending industry is hardly unregulated. Half the damn paperwork I used to have to do as a loan office was related to federal regulation. This is the same regulatory environment that existed in the 90's. How do I know? I was a loan officer from 97-99. There were fraudulent loans made then. How do I know?
The problem wasn't primarily the regulatory environment --which was essentially unchanged from previously-- but the huge injection of money into the financial system in the 90's and also in 2001-2003. The banks were awash in a lot of money, and banks needed to do something with it. And they lowered lending standards. No doc, stated income, no verification loans. I remember Greenpoint Mortgage being the only one doing this in 97/98, and by 2005 almost everyone was. They all have looked the other way on sketchily documented loans. Easy credit increased access. Increased access increased demand. Increased demand led to rising prices on real estate. The rise was unsustainable. The chickens have come home to roost. The same thing happened with tech stocks in the late 90's.
The Federal Reserve was responsible, it is the body that sets monetary policy, it is independent of the executive branch, and it derives it's authority from Congress. Also, Greenspan, the man who was at the helm of the Federal Reserve was not a Bush appointee.
By the way, regardless of the ease of access to credit, no one puts a gun to your head and makes you take out a loan you can't afford. Federal Truth In Lending regulation obligates lenders to inform borrowers of the true costs of borrowing.
People are just stupid.
The Pentagon and Homeland Security divisions got a budget increase to about half a trillion dollars,
Yep.
while spending for education, infrastructure and health care was frozen somewhere around $350 billion. The America in which I grew up, the America I knew, used to invest in its people, knowing there would be a payoff in productivity and competitiveness later.
Infrastructure spending ALONE is over 400 billion:
http://economistsview.typepad.com/economistsview/2008/05/infrastructure.html
Federal spending on education reached record levels--by a huge margin!--during this administration (not that I agree with it).
Ditto for spending on healthcare (not that I agree):
Recent American leadership seems to be short-sighted and beholden to the wealthy and influential. The middle-class which made America great is in notable decline.
Rampant immigration, much of it illegal, depresses wages. Unfair "Free Trade" agreements flood our markets with cheap foreign goods and make domestic business uncompetitive. I am a proponent of free trade in theory, but it needs to be implemented much differently than we have to date. We are getting screwed.
There's less freedom of speech for dissenters.
What a steaming crock of fresh fertilizer.
"Fuck Bush".
There, I said it. When are the men in black going to come get me?
Squashed dissent?
In my own home town:
Whose repressing these nimrods? Who repressed Cindy Sheehan when she camped outside Bush's ranch for months? Who represses Cod Pink when some wildeyed moonbat shoves their bloody hands in Condolezza Rice's face and disrespects wounded soldiers at Walter Reed? If anything, the last 7 years has been nothing but an unending stream of barking moonbat protests from sea to shining sea. Lunacy.
People's telephones are being tapped with no warrant. It's supposedly to increase security, but if you believe that -- you have no idea what the phrase "Big Brother" means.
Aye, and I do not support the warrantless wiretaps legislation. Still in a time of war, temporary measures are justified. In the heightened climate post-911, I thought it was necessary. I think these measures are no longer justified.
If you're a Green party member or an anti-war protestor, your name is quite likely to be on a watch list. "First amendment zones" are created for any anti-Bush protestors, and police cameras are trained on those zones.
Queue in twilight zone music please! Whenever there a large groups of people demonstrating, it is law enforcement's legitimate function to make sure there is no violence.
I love America and the ideals it stands for.
Don't we all. Some of us live in reality however.
BTS
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Gopher
So as the libertarian that I think you are, do you think life is just hunky-dory and getting better here in America? Do we have MORE freedoms than we did before? I don't think so, call me delusional if you want. If you think so, you certainly have the right to your opinion.
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BurnTheShips
So as the libertarian that I think you are, do you think life is just hunky-dory and getting better here in America? Do we have MORE freedoms than we did before? I don't think so, call me delusional if you want. If you think so, you certainly have the right to your opinion.
Bush has increased the size and scope of government, politically, he is no friend of mine. Neither are Clinton, Obama or McCain. But out of these, who is the least likely to grow the government? I liked Ron Paul, until I suspected he was an antisemite and a white racist.
Aside from possible wiretaps, I don't think I am any less free than I was 7 years ago. I am certainly doing better than I was then. Some of Bush's policies have been very bad. The war has been horribly mismanaged among other things. Katrina was a huge bungle. The federal budget hs skyrocketed. But we have hardly said "good-bye" to democracy. The peaceful transfer of power to whoever will be the next democratically elected President next year will be proof of this. BTS -
journey-on
Gopher, I'm really sorry if your life is not hunky-dory....truly.
Mine is. I still have all the freedoms I have ever had and even though I am not at all happy about gas prices and grocery prices,
the highways are still crowded with cars and trucks doing their thing, and the grocery stores are still full of people buying food
for their family. My business has seen an increase this year in sales, my cusomer base is stronger than ever, and I am optimistic
about next year. Hills and valleys, my friend. I've lived long enough to know that there will be good years and bad years. The
thing about American ingenuity is: we WILL eventually find the answers to the problems if we work together to do so. We have
checks and balances in place to keep certain things from going over the top and the pendulum swings as it needs to swing.
Have faith, my friend.
EDITED TO ADD: WOW, BURN...YOU ROCK WITH THE FACTS!!
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Seeker4
Isn't it grand to be able to debate all this shit?
You'd NEVER have a discussion like this in the Kingdom Hall!!
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snowbird
You just said a mouthful, Seeker4!
J-O, I think Gopher is more concerned for the welfare of others than himself. That's what I get from his posts, anyway.
You're all a great bunch of people. I wish I could hug each and every one of you.
Sylvia
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journey-on
J-O, I think Gopher is more concerned for the welfare of others than himself
Snowbird...you are a sweetheart and I always read your posts. I hope you weren't implying that I am not concerned for the
welfare of others just because I verbalized my own contentment.
You have to start with your OWN life. When you make your life happy and prosperous, you are in a better position to help
others find the same. I pay taxes....lots of them. I want my taxes to go toward the betterment of the whole country in a
well-thought-out balance that includes all our needs, not just the needs of a particular segment. I also believe in personal
charitable donations to causes that are near and dear to me that perhaps aren't covered as much as I would like through
the divisions of the tax pie.
I like what Jesus said: Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach him to fish and you feed him for a lifetime.
I know it's overused, but for good reason.
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snowbird
Snowbird...you are a sweetheart and I always read your posts. I hope you weren't implying that I am not concerned for the
welfare of others just because I verbalized my own contentment
As I always do yours.
No, of course not!
Sylvia
