Jesus.....God or God's son? (page 22)

allelsefails

I might not have answered your question. Yes Deut6:4-5 is awesome as is 12:29-30. Remember the relationship of Father and Son is Father gives life to Son. But it also means Son is equal in capabilities to the father, just not in position.

possible-san

Jesus is not YHWH as I explained repeatedly.

Probably, the head will get confused if reniaa talks with people who say such.

possible

Spike Tassel

Pronunciation changes as language does. So does translation as perspective does. Then there is a practice called transliteration: changing the elements of one script (e.g. alphabet or syllabary or logography) to an alphabet, not to mention transcription with its several aspects. William Tyndale (a Bible translater who wrote in the orthography of what I categorize as Early Modern English) spelled Jesus' name as (what I transcribe as) Jhesus at least sometimes [as is shown in the June 1, 2009 Watchower illustration on page 9 regarding Matthew 1:1], just as one example. Even if the Tetragrammaton in English is spelled J-e-h-o-v-a-h, there are several acceptable pronuniciations of it, which vary depending on where in the English world you live and your cultural background, and that's probably true for every last word in the English language, I would venture. As to whether the term "son of God" refers to Jesus, I suggest that it depends on which passage and translation/ version you are referring to. Even the term "God/ god" may refer to Jesus, again depending on which passage and translation/ version of the Bible you are referring to. Whether the particular passage accurately reflects Jehovah's position on the matter is another topic entirely. Each passage has its own history of analysis.

reniaa

hi allelsefails

guess jesus was lying here too according to you

John 14:28
"You heard me say, 'I am going away and I am coming back to you.' If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I.

jesus never admits to being equal to God.

HI possible san

It's true trinitarians have written themselves into a corner..according to them Jesus has to be YHWH to allow for Deut 6:4 because it is making YHWH the ONE. So in Praising YHWH JW's are not doing anything wrong we are just praising the greater expression of Jesus acording to trinity.

But then those that do not say Jesus is YHWH have also painted themselves into a Corner because they are then disobeying scripture by worshiping jesus instead of YHWH

Matthew 4:10
Jesus said to him, "Away from me, Satan! For it is written: 'Worship the Lord(YHWH) your God, and serve him only.' "

more importantly they are disobeying Jesus in whom they are supposedly following.

You cannot change the scriptures and they back witnesses up completely. I'll give outlaw this he has the only argument any can try and use and that is by using Jehovah we are somehow at fault since the original pronouciation is lost incorporating what is Gods official and definite written name YHWH into a spoken language by addition of vowels thus making the English version of it, is the only way they can try and fault us. but in doing this they have to discount that they no longer pronounce Jesus correctly but apparently thats okay!!! They have to fall back into the position of Jewish superstition that pronoucing Jehovah's name is somehow sacred and wrong but then that still falls with their insistance of glorifying Jesus above him or equal to him.

Reniaa

possible-san

Hi, reniaa.

I think that you have two problems.

(1)
You do not understand the Trinity doctrine at all.

That is, Jesus is not Jehovah.
And the father is greater than the son.
This is the Trinity doctrine.

(2)
You are not arguing with the Trinitarians who value the divine name.

Jehovah's Witnesses only imitated the Christians who value the divine name.

possible

reniaa

hi possible san

Deut 6:4 is insumountable YHWH is the ONE!!!! if Jesus isn't part of this ONE then he isn't God and their isn't a trinity!

Reniaa

ninja

is jehovah our father or grandfather?

reniaa

HI Possible san

I am well aquainted with the trinitarian statement of making Jesus Greater in glory than God, equal in nature to God , lower in position to God but it is just unbiblical rhetoric and thus meaningless as well as being a plateful of oxymorons.

Reniaa

ninja

the governing body are a plateful of poxy morons

possible-san

reniaa.

I said that you do not understand the Trinity doctrine.
You need to be conscious of it first.

Since you do not have that consciousness, you write only wrong things.

In the Trinity, YHWH is the Father and it is natural that "the Father is one person."
But the word "God" is the plural in Hebrew.
So, literal translation is "Gods."

if Jesus isn't part of this ONE then he isn't God

Even the NWT is said that Jesus is "a god."

I think that you should become more modest.

possible

Jesus.....God or God's son?

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