do Jehovah witness teaches about grace and what it is?

by evangelist 1 83 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • evangelist 1
    evangelist 1

    Why the bible didn't say 144-000 new yorker JHW instead of 144.000 israelites, ur does those JHW think they are Jewish JHW?

    Just an observation!

    Again if they don't teach grace then they are not allowed to read Romans and EPHesians and 1 corthians I think.

    The bible say Jesus was a Jew unless they don'z believe the bible no more, and heaven , don't they know the Jew were and still are God chosen people even though they are still blind to the truth?

    Even christians are proud or glad to be able to be grafted into the Jewish family as such.

    Does the JHW know that Jehavah God himself is grace just like He is love, so in a way if they don'z teach the love grace of God , they really are teaching about another God they don'z know but only heard some thing about Him!

    one love

  • Heaven
    Heaven

    evangelist 1 ... JWs do not believe they are Jewish. They believe that everyone that is not a JW, including Jewish people, will not survive Armageddon and that those that died before Armageddon, will not be resurrected. There will be no Jewish people in Heaven (edited to add: except for Jesus... but they try to ignore that he was Jewish).

  • evangelist 1
    evangelist 1

    Hello heaven

    i only have five more post i can do tell the next 24 hours so i am very new here and i really need as much information as possible, so I have a question how I can get my question answers.

    Can I re edeit my post after reading what someone else wrote to answer or give question without using more post?

    i have not seen this not being not allowed but I want to be sure, because if I can add to my former post i can continue with other here , but others would have to read my former post again to see my responce if any.

    Please let me know ASAP if this is possible!

    Also how do I get to modify or change my profile or put my picture in the avator???

    Thank you !

    Danke!

    Shalom

    Hello outlaw

    I just added this on just for your statement about not being able to arace after 30 minutes.

    But maybe that might be correct because I didn't try eracing but just added this 12 hours latter, or did you just say that to show JHW can lie unless you prove what is right and possible?

    one love

    Hello heaven

    I read your post below and I am answering your post a day latter now.

    If what you are saying is true about them getting brain washed , by the WTS , why don't the people in the WTS come together and have their own groups and do their own bible study to get the truth themselves without the Society, or at least try it to see if the society are telling the truth or the bible is the truth and what they understand??

    BTW I think it is good if I ask alot of questions from people who are ex JHW because of their experiences from both sides, being bound and now being free!

    The other thing I think is wrong is that they don't ask question themselves and want to be the teacher always and this is very wrong, and a tactic which the WTS is usuing on them to keep them manipulated and in fear of a armagadion!

    I will respond to your next post here ok heaven?

    Lot of Love

  • OUTLAW
  • Heaven
    Heaven

    evangelist 1 ... I think you have already received some good answers. Part of your difficulty may stem from the fact that you are coming from a completely different paradigm than JWs. Understanding their core beliefs may be what you need to research next. Here is a link that may help with that: http://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/core-watchtower-concepts.php

    It takes time to fully understand all that is going on within the Jehovah's Witnesses. And your questions are going to lead to even more questions. Accepting that they are really a dangerous, high mind-control cult may actually help you to understand our answers more. If you are unfamiliar with mind-control tactics, check out this link: http://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/fear-cult-mind-control.php

    Most JWs don't know everything, either, about their so-called religion, especially the history and origins of the organization. Things constantly change too so there are continually shifting answers depending on which doctrines are under revision. I hope you're not getting dizzy yet. (I know I used to when I was a teenager studying with them).

    Regarding editing your posts... you have about 30 minutes to re-edit one of your posts once you have submitted it. To do this, click on the pencil in the conversation bubble in the upper right hand corner of your post located right beside the date. Another tactic might be to wait for a few responses and then type up your responses and questions in a Notepad or Word type application, then copy and paste it into the Post a reply. This might help with your posting limit for now.

    Simon is currently working on changing the site to enable profile updating. This is currently not available at this time. However, the site has recently been linked into 'Gravatar' and so, you can attempt to put your Globally Recognized Avatar up and link it back to this site by using the same email you used to sign up with here. I have tried to get it to work for me but have been unsuccessful so I have to wait for Simon's changes. At any rate, check out this link in order to set up your Gravatar: http://en.gravatar.com/

    You can also use the Personal Message (called a 'PM') to ask certain posters more questions of a sensitive or personal nature. To do this click on the envelope in the upper right corner of the discussion board page, right next to your username.

    don't they know the Jew were and still are God chosen people even though they are still blind to the truth?

    No, they don't. The Jewish are no longer God's Chosen. Jehovah's Witnesses are. They were chosen in 1919 by Jesus Christ, who invisibly returned in 1914 to look around the Earth and select "God's Chosen Organization".

    Does the JHW know that Jehavah God himself is grace just like He is love, so in a way if they don'z teach the love grace of God , they really are teaching about another God they don'z know but only heard some thing about Him!

    No, JWs do not know that God himself is grace. Their view of Jehovah is that if they follow the Governing Body's instructions, they have a chance at passing judgment from Jehovah and Christ, and will gain eternal life. If they do not do as God's Chosen Organization's Governing Body (known as the Faithful and Discreet Slave) tells them to do, they will either not survive Armageddon or, if they die before Armageddon's arrival, they will not be resurrected.

    Sorry for taking so long. I had a lot to type and lost most of it thanks to a mistake I made clicking myself away from the board and having to type this in all over again! Should take my own advice and use Notepad. Hope this helps. Talk to you soon.

  • evangelist 1
    evangelist 1

    Hello Heaven

    Thank you for those links and what I have to say is above in my last post which you said I can only type after 30 minutes!

    Hello Terry

    What does that have to do with all our sins which is forgiven by grace and what Jesus finished on the cross for the whole world??

    one love

  • Terry
    Terry

    Let us take a look at Jesus' dramatic plea while dying at the hands of the Romans and the Jews: "Father, forgive them..."

    followed by this interesting tagline, "...for they KNOW NOT what they do."

    Let's not be too quick to say we understand what that last part is actually referring to.

    Ignorance is no excuse and never has been. It can, at best, be a mitigating circumstance for a judge to consider when deciding on punishment.

    Jesus said he had the power to forgive. He was called out as a Blasphemer for this since "...only God can forgive sins...".

    This situation only comes up in discussion when somebody wants to prooftext the Trinity doctrine. The actual issue of forgiveness is seldom discussed for some strange reason.

    IF A BASIS for forgiveness (Grace) is mentioned anywhere it is here when Jesus says, "...for they know not what they do."

    If the Jews did not understand the Law who would?

    If Pilate did not understand he was sending an innocent man to death why would HE SAY he found no fault with Jesus?

    Pilate represented Rome.

    On what basis did Pilate hand Jesus over?

    Do you see where I'm going with this?

  • Heaven
    Heaven

    If what you are saying is true about them getting brain washed , by the WTS , why don't the people in the WTS come together and have their own groups and do their own bible study to get the truth themselves without the Society, or at least try it to see if the society are telling the truth or the bible is the truth and what they understand??

    Hi evangelist 1 ... JWs will be disfellowshipped (excommunicated) and shunned if they study the Bible in their own groups without the Society's publications. In many cases, this means losing not only your close friends but also your family. You are considered 'dead' by all JWs. This is devastating to the one kicked out! JWs are told that they are not to question the Society because the Society is "God's Channel"; that they are being directed by God. The Society's Governing Body (aka the Faithful and Discreet Slave) has also taken over Jesus Christ's position as mediator for the average JW (called a 'publisher'). Jesus Christ is now the mediator to only the special 'annointed' class of JW (the 144,000 that go to heaven).

    BTW I think it is good if I ask alot of questions from people who are ex JHW because of their experiences from both sides, being bound and now being free!

    Yes, asking JWs a lot of questions is definitely good to help get them thinking but you have to ask the right questions in the right way. In other words, do no appear to be attacking them or their beliefs because they have been indoctrinated to believe that they will be persecuted by evil, worldly people under Satan's control, which only serves to cement their beliefs further. I personally use the beliefs that are either contradictory or non-existent in the Bible. The Watchtower definitely contradicts the Bible. I ask JWs to show me the scripture that supports said belief, making sure that the belief is NOT support in the Bible first. It helps to prepare ahead of time for your encounters with JWs.

    Asking ex-JWs a lot of questions is good as well because you will be told things that JWs will NOT tell you. You will see a side to this organization that is not presented publicly by JWs.

    The other thing I think is wrong is that they don't ask question themselves and want to be the teacher always and this is very wrong, and a tactic which the WTS is usuing on them to keep them manipulated and in fear of a armagadion!

    I completely agree with you that it is wrong to disallow people from asking questions. This is the first indicator that an organization is using mind control tactics.

    There are 2 basic phases to JWs: pre and post baptism.

    Prior to baptism and while you are just studying with a JW, you are allowed to ask questions. If you ask questions that cannot be answered, you are told that they will be answered 'in time'. Sometimes you are told that you are not ready for the answers yet. My Mom always told me "I was not meant to know the answer." (In my head, my response to this was always "If I am meant to ask the question, I am then meant to know the answer."). As a study, if you persist and ask too many questions, you will be told that you are probably not cut out to be a JW and the study will cease.

    Once you are a baptized JW, you are NOT allowed to ask questions, especially of the Watchtower and it's Governing Body. If you persist, you will be 'shepherded' (counseled -- which really means admonished/reproved/reprimanded). If you still persist after being counseled you risk being disfellowshipped and being shunned. My uncle persisted and was disfellowshipped.

  • evangelist 1
    evangelist 1

    Hello heaven

    Then this is why they are decieved because they accept everything from their society without any study of the truth , and just going by claim it name it !

    Maybe that is why they will be going to hell with a bible in there hands!

    When I ask question they say they would come back and give me an answer but they never do, or they plain out lie!

    one love

  • Heaven
    Heaven

    When I ask question they say they would come back and give me an answer but they never do, or they plain out lie!

    Hi evangelist 1 ... the reason JWs don't return is because you are too knowledgable and therefore, not considered a good candidate to become a JW. They want people who will accept what they have to teach without question. And, yes, you are correct... JWs tell falsehoods. Their religion is built on them. Their doctrines are all false as are their prophecies. Most JWs don't see this due to mind-control and indoctrination. JWs are not allowed to read 'apostate' literature, or the old literature of the Watchtower from the past.

    When I ask my Father (a JW Ministerial Servant) questions, I get silence. He does not know the answers. I think this is also due to some doubts he has and the fact that he knows I am not going to be a JW. He may even consider me an 'apostate' to a certain degree. I do believe my Father does not want to lie though. This may also be why he doesn't say anything. He is aging and his mind is not working like it used to.

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