Why do all intelligent Christians disobey Jesus? (page 6)

PSacramento

Sorry bud, but that's pretty lame. I don't see anything close to "We are all God's children, even those that reject him..." in that passage. You just avoided the question.

Peter basically says that the "end" hasn't come because God wants ALL HIS children (not wanting anyone to perish) to come to him, IF the only children God has are those that are already God's, what is he waiting for ???

I didn't avoid your question, but I see that you avoide mine by"answering" it with a question, but allow me to answer you:

Do you believe Jesus/God is so powerless that he doesn't control the circumstances of His Children?

I believe THAT kind of control is not what GOd and Jesus are about, no.

From my POV, you see Jesus/God as either, weak and can't control the circumstances of the lives of his children, or so unloving he doesn't care. Where is your faith?

I see Jesus as weak because I see his Love as unbound by what MAN thinks it SHOULD be?

My faith is unshakable, and it is placed on Our Lord Jesus, Our Beloved Abba and the HS that reveals their love to Us.

Where else should it be ??

So tell me, was Ghandi God's child?

Is someone that has been so destroyed by the WT that they become an athiest, God's child?

Deputy Dog

PSac

Peter basically says that the "end" hasn't come because God wants ALL HIS children (not wanting anyone to perish) to come to him, IF the only children God has are those that are already God's, what is he waiting for ???

All God's Children (all those who come) were chosen before the foundation of the world ( Eph 1:4 ). He waiting for all those whom He choose (and those whom He choose, He also calls) to come to Him. That's what He's waiting for!!!

I see Jesus as weak because I see his Love as unbound by what MAN thinks it SHOULD be?

It looks like you are the one binding God with the (free) will of man.

My faith is unshakable, and it is placed on Our Lord Jesus, Our Beloved Abba and the HS that reveals their love to Us.
Where else should it be ??

Well, has God revealed the gospel (His love) to Ghandi or this "athiest" that you speak of? From my POV I don't see it. But I'm not the Judge.

All this is getting away from the question that you are avoiding, Who told you that all humans are God's children? You asked me about Ghandi, let me ask you about Hitler or the Pharisees, do you think they are Gods Children?

not a captive

Maybe we should give our answers through questions for the most part. At least for the sake of discussion.

The verses coming up to 2 Pet. 3:9 tells about a flood that swept the ungodly away. So, it would seem that God wants his children to stop disowning him but that some people reject God. The worst that happens? We die.

But, again, the terms of salvation? Reading Jesus' life and sermons without "religious" definitions of what he means is taking time. I trust God will value Ghandi appropriately as he will those so miserably damaged by the WTS.

I trust that God is kinder than we are. We still are alive, there's still alot to hope for. And alot of questions.

PSacramento

All God's Children (all those who come) were chosen before the foundation of the world ( Eph 1:4 ). He waiting for all those whom He choose (and those whom He choose, He also calls) to come to Him. That's what He's waiting for!!!

Do you know who they are? I don't.

It looks like you are the one binding God with the (free) will of man.

The bindings are OURS, not God's.

Well, has God revealed the gospel (His love) to Ghandi or this "athiest" that you speak of? From my POV I don't see it. But I'm not the Judge.

Neither am I, hence only God and Jesus can judge, they KNOW, we don't.

All this is getting away from the question that you are avoiding, Who told you that all humans are God's children? You asked me about Ghandi, let me ask you about Hitler or the Pharisees, do you think they are Gods Children?

The HS told me that all our God's children, just like Jesus directed all to pray "Our Father" and since ALL types were there on that sermon, then ALL who CHOOSE to pray to Our Father are his children.

Was Hitler one of God's children? were the Pharises?

You are asking me to Judge, I can't, not my place.

Could they have BEEN if not for what they choose to be and do?

Perhaps.

If Hitler has died at 4 years of age, whould he have been one of God's children?

Only God can say, I do know this:

I am NOT qualified to say who ISN'T God's child, if that isn't passing judgement then I don't know what is.

I'll leave that call to Jesus.

Deputy Dog

nac

I trust that God is kinder than we are. We still are alive, there's still alot to hope...

On this we agree.

snowbird

Very good points about judging, PSac.

It is sufficient that the Father knows who belong to Him.

Syl

Deputy Dog

PSac

Was Hitler one of God's children? were the Pharises?

You are asking me to Judge, I can't, not my place.

That's my point! Jesus said some humans are NOT God's children. Look at what he said to the Pharises

Joh 8:42

Jesus said to them, "If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and have come from God, for I have not even come on My own initiative, but He sent Me. 43"Why do you not understand what I am saying? It is because you cannot hear My word. 44"You are of your father the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth because there is no truth in him. Whenever he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies.

leavingwt

That's my point! Jesus said some humans are NOT God's children.

DD -- PSac is a hopeless romantic. He wants us all to be saved, but it just cannot be so. I admire his big heart.

Deputy Dog

PSac

If Hitler has died at 4 years of age, whould he have been one of God's children?

There you go again with that "If" stuff again. Hitler didn't die at 4 years of age. God knew exactly what second he would die, and what second he would be born.

Deputy Dog

Leaving

I admire his big heart.

I understand it, I think

Why do all intelligent Christians disobey Jesus?

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