*Grace* According to JW's. Your thoughts will be appreciated.

by Lily Pie 272 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  Lily Pie

  Good point designs.

  I think it is risky for people to hop from one religion (which is spiritually abusive) to another. Maybe you are right, people like this might need a security blanket, and indeed are not addressing the real issues in thier life. It's tricky, I can't really appreciate what it is to be a JW, and then convert to Christianity, though surely it is clear by what people say on this board that exiting the religion can be traumatic in many different ways. Going to another religion might be counter productive. If you think I am on here to convert others, you are mistaken, (you might reach that conlcusion I can not blame you for that), I don't think that it would be tactful or dignified.

  I used to be a huge *hater* of ALL religion. JW'S were a little worse then the others, because they like knocking on doors at 9.30 on a Saturday morning.... ;) I changed my mind over time however. Before accepting Christ, I was extremely successful, personally and professionally and very happy. Not insecure, actually everything was great. Thats what is amazing, it was challenging and uncomfortable to become a Christian, it took a lonf time, I didn't fit in at first, but I was, and still am compelled to it. Once you start believing in the possibility, the reality leaps out.... It is a supernatural experience.

  Though Designs, seriously, it is a good point that you make. I absolutely can see your point of view. Really...
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  tec

  Many people have summed up what I think grace is. Love from God, forgiveness and mercy - enough to cover any wrongdoing on our behalf. I opened one of those spam e-mails once, and it said this:

  "God loves us because of who he is, not because of who we are."

  I think that shows his grace. The quote brought tears to my son's eyes when he read it with me. He was eleven at the time.

  Tammy
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  leavingwt

  I think it is sad if People see Grace/undeserved kindness as a license to to sin or not to obey God.

  This statement, above, by an active JW, demonstrates quite clearly and definitively, that WT doesn't have a clue about Grace.
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  james_woods

  Just the terminology is interesting:

  GRACE - a positive "gift" which is freely given...

  UNDESERVED KINDNESS - OK, we are going to be kind to you THIS TIME, but remember that YOU DO NOT DESERVE IT...

  What is interesting is which one the legalistic and judgemental watchtower organization insists upon.
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  Deputy Dog

  Debator

  Where was the work of the criminal in Luke 23 who died beside Christ?
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  Deputy Dog

  leavingwt

  I think it is sad if People see Grace/undeserved kindness as a license to to sin or not to obey God.

  This statement, above, by an active JW, demonstrates quite clearly and definitively, that WT doesn't have a clue about Grace.

  I agree.

  The sad thing is, many in main stream denominations stuggle with it as well.
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  tenyearsafter

  Debator,

  Please answer Deputy Dog...I also want to know what the work of the evil-doer who died beside Jesus was?

  As to Grace versus undeserved kindness, I see undeserved kindness as "dumbing down" Grace so JW can set themselves apart from Christendom and show how much closer to God they are. It is similar to their arguing that Jesus died on an upright stake versus on a cross...is the instrument of his death more important than the purpose of his death? They would rather argue the differences.

  What is offensive about using the word Grace instead of undeserved kindness to a Witness? I guarantee that a JW will cringe at the thought of using Grace, as it has been drilled into them as being a teaching of pagan Christendom. By the way, Grace was commonly used by C.T. Russell, the founder of the WT...another reason they distance themselves from it today.
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  tec

  The sad thing is, many in main stream denominations stuggle with it as well.

  I think I may struggle also, since I'm not sure what's wrong with the statement Debator made, in this instance. People do use grace as a license to sin - as in, well, I have God's grace, so I'll just do whatever I feel like even though its wrong. It might not change the grace itself, but it is an abuse of it. Not trying to argue, am happy to hear responses.

  Tammy
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  isaacaustin

  Reniaa aka Debator said: I think it is sad if People see Grace/undeserved kindness as a license to to sin or not to obey God.

  My reply: That's how JWs see it...Christians do not see it that way.
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  tenyearsafter

  Tammy,

  JW's use undeserved kindness (facilitated by the WTS) as an excuse to sin just as much as Christians use Grace as an excuse. We are all imperfect, so if perfect works was a requirement for Grace/undeserved kindness from God, we would all be sunk!

  TYA