by Spade 382 Replies latest watchtower bible
Alice:
"Everyone here has completely missed the point, that the Bible is a highly unified book that points to a time when God's Kingdom as a visible organization will emerge from Christendom and will put an end to all other kingdoms."
If that was your point, then why didn't you call this thread "The Bible - A Highly Unified Book"???
I thought your point was about the dates for the Gentile Times???
Round and round the merry-go-round!
Villabolo
It's the same thing every time with Alice. Dredge up an already-discussed-to-death subject, stir up some shit, ignore every single shred of evidence or argument against the claim of the day, then change the subject.
Infuriating, yes. Yet, still useful as a case study in unreasonableness for the lurkers and newbies.
No one expects Spade/Alice to behave Rationally..
Or to comprehend anything other than her own Delusions..
"607 BCE must Be Right"
"This is a Fresh Bottle of Glue!"
...................
...OUTLAW
@Spade: You wrote:
Everyone here has completely missed the point, that the Bible is a highly unified book that points to a time when God's Kingdom as a visible organization will emerge from Christendom and will put an end to all other kingdoms.
The statement above is far removed from your opening post. The issue under discussion is NOT the above statement. The issue we are considering is whether Jerusalem was destroyed in 607 BC, as the WTB&TS asserts. Please try to keep your eye on the ball.
“And in the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be brought to ruin. And the kingdom itself will not be passed on to any other people. It will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms, and it itself will stand to times indefinite; forasmuch as you beheld that out of the mountain a stone was cut not by hands, and [that] it crushed the iron, the copper, the molded clay, the silver and the gold. The grand God himself has made known to the king what is to occur after this. And the dream is reliable, and the interpretation of it is trustworthy.” Daniel 2:44-45
So? This has no bearing on the real topic here - mainly, whether or not Jerusalem was destroyed in 607 BC.
The excavated heterogeneous fragments that conflict with the Bible's historical cannon don't compare with the complete and harmonious Biblical chronology, which gives us a time-line without contradictions, showing the total fulfillment of every prophecy Jehovah gave us.
If you are referring to the business documents as "fragments", then your statment is false. They don't conflict with Biblical chronology concerning the fall of Jerusalem. If by "fragments" you mean the astronomical diaries, then your statement is false. These, also, do not conflict with Biblical concerning the fall of Jerusalem. All these fragments DO conflict with the WT's version of history. This, however, is the WT's problem. And your problem.
it-1 p. 310 Bible The Bible is not an unrelated assortment or collection of heterogeneous fragments from Jewish and Christian literature. Rather, it is an organizational book, highly unified and interconnected in its various segments, which indeed reflect the systematic orderliness of the Creator-Author himself. God’s dealings with Israel in giving them a comprehensive law code as well as regulations governing matters even down to small details of camp life—things that were later mirrored in the Davidic kingdom as well as in the congregational arrangement among first-century Christians—reflect and magnify this organizational aspect of the Bible.
So? This has no bearing on the real topic here - mainly, whether or not Jerusalem was destroyed in 607 BC. Incidentally, I don't agree with the Bible being an "organizational book", as if the WTS has some special claim of ownership to its pages. Again, please try to keep your eye on the ball.
I provided some information that you think would allow a person to step back and look at the big picture. As for the meticulous details, the fact of the matter is the archeology is there to support the end of Jewish exile at 537 B.C.E. From this date, count back seventy years to 607 B.C.E. as the year for Jerusalem's destruction. It's just that simple. None of these facts will not go away if you choose to ignore them. Maybe the Bible as the unerring, inspired Word of God has been repudiated by most here.
The Bible provides a great "big picture" at Jeremiah 25:11. Unfortunately, for the WTB&TS' interpretation to be correct, we would all have to ignore grammar. This is one of the principle points in "The Gentile Times Reconsidered". Please read it! It shows how all of the scriptures involved, if read grammatically and in context, agree with the historical sources 100% of the time; and how all of the scriptures involved agree with the WT's version of history 0% of the time.
MeanMrMustard
MeanMrMustard, I salute you! Awesome post, nice name and avatar to boot!
Nil Points to Alice...
The statement above is far removed from your opening post. The issue under discussion is NOT the above statement. The issue we are considering is whether Jerusalem was destroyed in 607 BC, as the WTB&TS asserts. Please try to keep your eye on the ball.
No, it is not. Facts about the Bible give reason to hold it in higher esteem when coming to conclusions about the related history.
Insight on the Scriptures pp. 448-450 Chronology
The Bible, by contrast, gives an unusually coherent and detailed history stretching through some 4,000 years, for not only does it record events with remarkable continuity from man’s beginning down to the time of Nehemiah’s governorship in the fifth century B.C.E. but also it may be considered as providing a basic coverage of the period between Nehemiah and the time of Jesus and his apostles by means of Daniel’s prophecy (history written in advance) at Daniel chapter 11. The Bible presents a graphic and true-to-life account of the nation of Israel from its birth onward, portraying with candor its strength and its weaknesses, its successes and its failures, its right worship and its false worship, its blessings and its adverse judgments and calamities. While this honesty alone does not ensure accurate chronology, it does give sound basis for confidence in the integrity of the Biblical writers and their sincere concern for recording truth.
So? This has no bearing on the real topic here - mainly, whether or not Jerusalem was destroyed in 607 BC.
The “seven times,” in Daniel 4:25 which Jesus called “the appointed times of the nations” from 607 B.C.E. along with a multitude of other scriptures point to the 20th century for the restoration of Jehovah's visible organization.
If you are referring to the business documents as "fragments", then your statment is false. They don't conflict with Biblical chronology concerning the fall of Jerusalem. If by "fragments" you mean the astronomical diaries, then your statement is false. These, also, do not conflict with Biblical concerning the fall of Jerusalem. All these fragments DO conflict with the WT's version of history. This, however, is the WT's problem. And your problem.
You can call it strictly a matter of Watchtower interpretation if you choose, but after Carl Jonson's interpretation a person is left completely clueless as to when Jehovah will intervene and act on behalf of human society.
The Bible provides a great "big picture" at Jeremiah 25:11. Unfortunately, for the WTB&TS' interpretation to be correct, we would all have to ignore grammar. This is one of the principle points in "The Gentile Times Reconsidered". Please read it! It shows how all of the scriptures involved, if read grammatically and in context, agree with the historical sources 100% of the time; and how all of the scriptures involved agree with the WT's version of history 0% of the time.
And all this land must become a devastated place, an object of astonishment, and these nations will have to serve the king of Babylon seventy years.”’ Jeremiah 25:11
The reason “these nations” was used in Jeremiah 25:11 is because the nation of Israel divided in 997 B.C.E. The Northern Kingdom was taken by Assyria and the Southern Kingdom by Babylon. Although Nebuchadnezzar held supreme rulership during Jerusalem's destruction, not every nation and surrounding region could have become a devastated place and taken into captivity. The context clearly indicates the prophecy was primarily against the tribe of Judah:
“From the thirteenth year of Josiah the son of A′mon, the king of Judah, and down to this day, these twenty-three years the word of Jehovah has occurred to me, and I kept speaking to you people, rising up early and speaking, but you did not listen. Jeremiah 25:3
Spade:
"You can call it strictly a matter of Watchtower interpretation if you choose, but after Carl Jonson's interpretation a person is left completely clueless as to when Jehovah will intervene and act on behalf of human society."
Duh! Could that be because of a willfully ignored and misunderstood (by some) Scripture that says:
36 “But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father. Matthew 24:36 New International Version
Also, a lack of answer on someone's part does not mean that your answer is right. There is always the possibility that you're both wrong. Assuming your question is valid in the first place, which the scripture above shows that it's not.
Villabolo
You tried posting pasting this drivel at Chron.com How many times does archeology conflict with the Bible's historical cannon?
It didn't fool anyone there either.
You tried posting pasting this drivel at Chron.com How many times does archeology conflict with the Bible's historical cannon?
It didn't fool anyone there either."
Does this joker ever provide a logical response to anything posted instead of going off topic and out on a limb making claims he can't back up.
