I have come to understand that the Trinity is acceptable to those that get it and will never make sense to those that don't get it.
It really is just the simple.
The trouble with Christianity. TRINITY.
by whereami 209 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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godrulz
It is either true or not. Though we do not understand it exhaustively, we can affirm the parameters it sets (God is one, yet compound vs solitary one). Once we know who Jesus is (YHWH/uncreated Creator vs creature) the rest follows (since monotheism is also obvious). There is no reason to give up on a triune understanding since revelation>reason (hundreds of millions find the trinity biblical and intellectually satisfying; it explains how God can become a man in Christ=incarnation/Immanuel, God with us).
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designs
PSac, godrulz-
It is not a matter of not understanding the doctrine, that's simple enough its the holes you can drive a car through that show it was just an invention by the Greek Bishops.
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TTWSYF
One trouble with the Trinity is the word 'Trinity'. It conjours up the association of paganism because of the word 'trinity'.
Trinity [the actual word] is not in the bible anywhere. fact.
The Trinity was not explicitly understood/explained until after the scriptures were written. fact.
Scripture indicates that there is a Trinity of beings who have the glory and power of God? fact. Some scriptural examples follow.
God raised Jesus from the dead, right? [gal1;1 says the Father raised Jesus, Romans 8;11 says the Holy Ghost raised Jesus, John 10;17-18 says that Jesus raised himself]
God dwells in believers [1cor 3;16-17] say the Father dwells in believers, [Romans 8;9] says that the Holy Ghost dwells in believers, [John 14;18] says that Jesus dwells in believers.
The Father searches the hearts and minds [Jer 17;10], The Holy Ghost searches the hearts and minds [1cor 2;10], Jesus searches the hearts and minds [Rev 2;23]
The Father gives us the words to speak [Math 10;19-20] Jesus gives us the words to speak [Luke 21;14-15] The Hoy Ghost gives us the words to speak [John 14;26]
Jesus commanded to be baptised in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost [one name, 3 beings]
The only way to absorb the fullness of all scripture, without contridiction, is to acknowledge that there is more to God than we can understand and furthermore, this 'progressive revelation' of the nature of God will continue as it has since humanilty had first cried to God.
Just mho.
respectfully,
dc
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TTWSYF
It is not a matter of not understanding the doctrine, that's simple enough its the holes you can drive a car through that show it was just an invention by the Greek Bishops.
Designs, Any proof to that statement?
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designs
Oh God read the $%^&*(* Creeds..............
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TTWSYF
Come on Designs, How about a specific example, after all, I should be able to drive a car through your examples, right?
Others have given scriptural examples, how about you?
respectfully,
dc
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designs
ohtaa-
Essence and Substance in the time of Aristotle and Socrates............
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TTWSYF
ohtaa-
Essence and Substance in the time of Aristotle and Socrates............
Designs- could you please be specific? I've read these comments from you before and you never give specific examples. I have no time to read through all of Aristotle and Socrates's extensive writtings. Can you please spell it out for us using phrases and pages?
Another scriptural [proof] text supporting that the Holy Ghost is God is in Mark 3;29 when the Holy Ghost is blasphemed.....Only God can be blasphemed, not an 'active force'.
respectfully,
dc
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godrulz
Essence/homoousias , etc. were Greek terms to define issues to separate orthodoxy and heterodoxy. Ontological terms may be philosophical, but they are still true. For e.g., God is spirit is a metaphysical statement in Jn. 4:24 that shows that God is not material. It is the stuff/being of God. It separates Him from man, rocks, trees, cookies, etc. These terms do not make a doctrine pagan and unbiblical, but they bring detail and precision in the face of heretical attacks that confuse the biblical parameters. It is important to state that Father/Son/Holy Spirit are of the same, one, eternal, uncreated spirit nature vs Arianism and polytheism. If we use a German, French, Greek, etc. concept, it does not change the reality of the biblical concept. Many WT concepts are not named in the Bible (theocracy, Governing Body, millennium, disfellowshipping, marking, blood transfusion, Christmas, voting, etc., yet a case is made for them, despite the labels; trinity word not in Bible is a typical, stupid WT argument, as is who ran universe if Jesus is God and He died for 3 days). Design is spouting WT propaganda out of ignorance of the history of doctrinal formation/dogma and Scripture itself. Many biblical, theological concepts can be described in technical, philosophical terms for precise communication. It does not make the truths pagan or any less true because the words are not in Scripture (most of the WT writing words are not explicitly in Scripture, including the name Jehovah itself!).