by Bangalore 170 Replies latest jw friends
The farcical suggestion that there is an ARMY of selfish silly young girls deliberately getting pregnant is nonsense.
Most young women have more sense. People who want to cut welfare programs to the genuinely needy spread this around. It doesnt say much for their intelligence. or the fools that fall for it.
"What thou seest, THAT thou beest" as the ungrammatical phrase goes.
HB
I am kind of reluctant to weigh in here (peace to you all!)... because it is really a very HUGE topic/area... but I will... because there are some misconceptions here, based, I've no doubt, on a lack of education as to the nation's various assistance programs.
Let's take the folks getting welfare living in the million-plus dollar house. That they are doing so pursuant to subsidies (per the article) is on the landlord, not them. Section 8 pays a certain amount toward the rent for those who are eligible. If the landlord is willing to place the rent at a level where Section 8 covers it... and many, MANY are (because it is "guaranteed" rent)... then the voucher can cover it. Most likely, the house is paid off in this case and so the "rent" is gravy. Why not rent to someone else, who can pay higher (market) rent? A number of reasons, including, again... the "guarantee." So long as the house passes HQS inspections... the rent check issues automatically.
Another reason that someone on welfare can live in such a house is anti-NIMBY laws/outlooks. NIMBY (Not In My BackYard) prohibits landlords, community citizens, and local authorities from "segregating" poor people into certain areas of town. By means of things like affordable housing developments (state/federally subsidized, tax credit) and Section 8 vouchers... a person can pretty much live anywhere they WANT... so long as they either qualify to live in the development... or a landlord is willing to rent to them.
Most probably, these folks' residency was brought to the attention of the feds by someone in the neighborhood... or a jealous friend/family member who knows their income sources... but has a problem with how they're living. The feds really better have crossed their T's and dotted their I's on this one (although, recent news about the Justice Department's participation in guns getting into the hands of Mexican drug cartels leave me somewhat skeptical!).
As for living "like a millionaire" on welfare... that is truly the exception to the rule! Most who live via entitlement program funding live one step away from the streets, if not death. Many are sick (either physically or mentally)... or just too overwhelmed with trying to live in a system that will eat you alive if you don't have (1) a decent grasp of the language, (2) a fairly decent ELEMENTARY education so that you can HAVE such grasp, (3) marketable job skills, (3) an adequate source of income, and/or (4) you have more mouths to feed than you are able. Couple that with very poor social education programs as to contraceptions/safe sex... and, even more so, the cultural taboos (due to the RELIGIOUS influence) against both... and you have a keg of gun powder awaiting ignition.
While many believe that some women just have kids to GET welfare, the truth is actually that they often have a second child in order to be able to take care of the first... and so on. Welfare doesn't PAY that much, dear ones. Not even enough to help with one child... if you don't have other help (family, housing assistance, childcare subsidy, etc.), as well. In addition, it is DESIGNED to keep people ON it, not help them get OFF (although, some municipalities/programs have been trying to remedy that over the past 10 or so years).
Why keep people ON welfare? As a way to keep "them" out (of certain areas/neighborhoods). As a way to circumvent NIMBY laws (which are fairly recent, in some places). If they can't AFFORD to live in my neighborhood... then it's not ME keeping them out, and not ME breaking any laws... or demonstrating any bigotry! So, there are penalties for trying to get off aid (created/enacted/voted on by those who wish to keep you ON it... and so out of THEIR neighborhoods!). For one, in most places there is no "grace" period and so your benefits are drastically cut (even eliminated altogether) if you DO get a job (although, someone finally saw the light and cities/counties are now trying to change that, as well). So what? So, now you have a job... and new expenses: first, childcare. Which is EXPENSIVE. You can't work if you don't have childcare. If you have more than one child... even worse. Second, transportation. You have to get TO work. If there's adequate public transportation where you live, that might help. Of course, that costs, too... sometimes twice/three times normal... and sometimes takes twice/three times as long (you have to take a bus to get the kids TO childcare, then another to work, etc.).
Or maybe you have a car; usually, it's an old clunker... that sucks up gas, burns oil, and has some kind of "check engine" light that comes on every other day. So, on top of your transportation costs, you have repairs costs. IF you can keep that hoopty running!
These folks also often live in places where the heat is spotty, the plumbing is severely outdated (and so often not working properly - i.e., backed-up toilets/tubs, clogged sinks, etc., laced with poisons such as lead and mold... and so whose children are often... OFTEN sick. A HIGH incidence of asthma, bronchitis, pneumonia, skin rashes/dermatitis, ear infections, viruses, colds, and more. So, then you have the added expense of OTC medications... often bought to offset a trip to the doctor (because that requires transportation, so more expense).
WHY do many of these folks settle for this life? Because... they were either raised in it themselves... or told by someone (a parent, teacher, another kid/parent, neighbor, TV... whathaveyou)... that this is ALL THEY'RE ENTITLED TO. For them, this is IT. This is what they were born into the world TO be and do. The perception is that the "world" (often including their own parents) doesn't care about them... and so, their thinking is... why should I? Most of them don't even believe they exist... at least, not to a point that matters (to anyone). It is very similar to the "caste" system thinking in India: this is their "place" in life!
How do I know this? Because as a housing administrator... these are the people I've worked with for close to 25 years. You cannot work in low-income housing as I have and not get to know what's REALLY going on... unless you simply choose not to (which many do, as it's just a job for some, and that's okay).
As for the vehicles... that is another misconception. MOST poor people drive cars that are SO banged up, SO on their last leg... that I personally wouldn't be caught dead in one. They are, IMHO, death traps: either waiting to blow up on you... or break down and leave you... and perhaps your children!... abandoned somewhere where you very life could be in peril (i.e., the side of the freeway!). How can I say this? Because of the exorbitant amount of money I have spent cleaning parking lots (of grease, transmission/brake fluid, oil)... cleaning/replacing carpets... removing old tires/parts... and TOWING. Accounting for these 3-4 activities alone are a major part of my housing budgets!
MOST of the "fancy" cars are driven by either "ballers" (folks who also sell drugs/contraband... and so pay cash at, for example, the auto auction... and while there are those, yes, they are truly the minority - they're just more visible and so SEEM to be a majority)... or by those who could only get "financing" on such cars. While traditional car dealers won't sell to them (due to unsufficient/poor credit) there are all kinds of small lot car dealers out there who finance onsite. And the payments aren't all that high; but they're just spread out forever! They sell used cars on the "easy credit" plan... which turns out to be 3-4 times the actually value of the vehicle. Like "rent-a-TV/furniture" places. Many who buy from them end up "trading" the car back after a couple years... for another. Which the dealer resells and makes more money off. And the cycle never really ends.
Do some people "play the system"? Of course. Just like the more affluent play THEIR systems (i.e., inside trading, ponzi schemes, the whole credit/housing mess). No class is immune from fraud against the government, people, etc. Every level has someone doing "dirt." Which is one of the reasons why people on the lower levels feel it's "okay" - try to convince the guy standing on the corner selling crack that he's worse than the guy with the fast motorboat who got it to the continent. Or the guy with enough money to carve a tunnel under the border to get it into the country. If you think these people don't know WHO brings that stuff in... your fooling yourselves. And it ain't all on the "cartels." The U.S. Government itself has been caught, what, at least twice now... "helping"? I refer back to the DOJ's current fiasco... as well as the whole Iran-Contra ordeal (almost entirely funded by crack sold in L.A.).
You can't convince poor, uneducated, sometimes mentally ill people of THEIR fraud and corruption... if they know of and see it at higher levels. In THEIR minds, they're only doing what "everyone else" is doing... "to get theirs." It is systematic... and highly unlikely to ever change, under the current way(s) "we"... "do business."
Everyone is merely trying to survive. Some, on the up and up... some, not so much. But just like you cannot generalize the rich (because many worked hard and made their fortunes most honestly)... you cannot generalize the poor. Indeed, the rich receive WAY more "subsidies" than the poor. Even Warren Buffet proclaimed how he pays less [income] taxes that his own secretary!!
We live in a country that was founded on the premise of wealth, dear ones... NOT poverty. And so poverty is not only maligned, it is villainized, often to the point of false rhetoric and propaganda. Wanna know what REALLY goes on in the welfare system? In the projects? On the streets? Among the "assisted" poor? You would have to either walk in their shoes... or at least accompany them... for a mile or so. Until then, you can only speculate as to their "road"... and doing so will often lead YOU down the wrong one as to understanding.
I hope this helps and, again, peace to you all!
A slave of Christ,
SA
Do some people "play the system"? Of course. Just like the more affluent play THEIR systems (i.e., inside trading, ponzi schemes, the whole credit/housing mess).
Good point, Shelby. Most people are only peripherally aware of the fraud in high places, and shrug it off as "What're you gonna do?" But for sheer outrage and venom-spewing - nothing beats taking apart a poor, ignorant, pathetic welfare mom who never had a chance and is trying to get by on $1200 a month. Many otherwise intelligent people actually believe that it's the welfare minorities who are the cause of our economic woes.
The RICH get plenty of tax breaks, free perks, HUGE bonuses and pay offs funded by the taxpayer.
This is NEVER EVER called a free ride or a handout. Certainly not welfare. (Even though most of them dont deserve it)
And of course look at all those cheap types who follow "The Rules " and land themselves a rich husband. God forbid that as they sun themselves at a spa or buy yet more jewels on an empty afternoon before picking the kids up from day care - God forbid that anybody call them a freeloading parasite.
HB
I have never agreed so thoroughly with Shel, until now,.......Bravo!
Good point, Shelby. Most people are only peripherally aware of the fraud in high places, and shrug it off as "What're you gonna do?" But for sheer outrage and venom-spewing - nothing beats taking apart a poor, ignorant, pathetic welfare mom who never had a chance and is trying to get by on $1200 a month. Many otherwise intelligent people actually believe that it's the welfare minorities who are the cause of our economic woes.
Nonsense, consistent people like myself decry it from all directions. This is just a "change the subject" tactic.
BTS
I have never agreed so thoroughly with Shel, until now,.......Bravo!
She did just drop a nuclear bomb on this thread. Real life is a mutha f#$#.
Greetings, dear LRG, and peace to you! I read the report, as well as the memos/exhibits... and I'm not sure I would draw the conclusion you seem to be trying to make, here. I mean, I guess I just don't understand how a President who takes office in January, under the auspices of two, potentially three, wars... a housing crisis... a credit crisis... a failing "stimulus" plan... various bank and other Wall Street bailouts... and so a recession that appears to be leading up to a depression... the need to get a new cabinet on board... as well as to begin establishing rapport with: troops (whose morale was in the toilet) and other UN/EU nations (which were ready to sanction cutting out throats)... can truly be responsible for a piece of legislation that was in the queue before he ever came on board... written, sanctioned, and being pushed by Ted Kenney (the "darling" of the Senate, to both Dems and Reps)... who was dying (and so had EVERYONE'S sympathy)... and was the "one you'd better agree with and listen to, Barry, if you want anyone here to like you"... which went into affect in August. A period of about, what, 8 months... to get up to speed... in spite of all the other "fires" that needed putting out? I personally can't see where such an expectation was/is reasonable.
Let me explain:
As a housing administrator, I don't have anywhere near the responsibilities of the President of the U.S. in my job... but even I have had things go over my head, behind my back, and/or fall through the cracks shortly after taking on a new position. On occasion, they are fairly large things. Given my own [very small and limited, in this context] experience, I don't understand how Mr. Obama is often accused of arrogance, etc., while at the same time expected to be, I guess, omniscient.
It takes me at least 2 years to clean up a property. That means, clear out the riffraff (including staff, if need be), shut down the crack houses, balance the books (indeed, bring them to the black!), and develop a good rapport with residents and (remaining) staff. Two years... at a minimum... to "right" the "wrongs" of whoever came before me. That is my speciality - turning around distress projects, primarily large (over 100 units) to superlarge (over 300 units)... which have been overrun with drugs and crime (including shootings/murders)... have overwhelming arrears and receivables, and are major sore spots in the community.
If it takes me at least two years to do that... on ONE housing site... I can't imagine anyone turning around an entire country... given the conditionthis one was in/heading when Mr. Obama took over... in less than, say, 5 years. It would be the VERY exceptional person who could do that, IMHO; indeed, I don't think it can be done, given all of the various departments and variables (such as the whole Rep/Dem ongoing "fight")... and if it is, I would call that a "miracle" and be the last to deny the one who did it had SOME kind of "divine" intervention. Okay, maybe not divine, but certainly "otherworldly."
Please note, I am not "for" or "against" Mr. Obama. I really am not either, as to him or ANY U.S./world "leader." I like some things they all do... and some things not so much. But I don't get things like this. It is unreasonable to expect ANYONE to know EVERYTHING that's going on within the various departments they oversee... on that large of a scale... given everything else going on... in that timeframe. It takes time. And, yes, you WILL "agree" to some things... and "disagree" as to others... which you may learn later that you SHOULDN'T have before you have a clear grasp of what they're really all about. But that's because you're supposed to be able to TRUST the people under you as to what THEY do and what THEY tell you is or isn't. Even Mr. Bush and Mr. Powell apparently did that... as to Sadam Husseing's WMDs, etc.
If you fail to so trust, then you're a micro-managing, immodest, arrogant jerk who can't seem to let others do THEY'RE jobs. And don't think it's easy to say, "I don't think they're doing their job." In Mr. Obama's case, these are civil servants... many unionized. Ever try to discipline/terminate a civil servant/union employee? Not that easy, let me tell you. So, you're kind of damned if you do... damned if you don't.
I realize that all of that should be taken into consideration when one takes a job... and I'm sure one does, to the extent one CAN. But since one cannot know ALL of the variables, some things must come out only later. To that person's chagrin, even embarrasment sometimes, yes, but even so.
Anyway, again, if the message you're trying to send is what I believe it to be, I really don't think it's realistic... or indicative. No offense, of course. Just my opinion.
Again, peace to you!
SA, on her own...
In Skeeterville, there are many a folk who are seemingly ok with living from paycheck to paycheck. ... or from welfare check to welfare check. Single moms get a check and housing assistance, then move in with the real papa and rent out the housing assistance provided home. Seen this done with my own eyes.
"Nonsense, consistent people like myself decry it from all directions. This is just a "change the subject" tactic."
And all I got from the above was Waaaaaa!
