YHWH v YHVH - yes, V not W

by *lost* 150 Replies latest watchtower bible

• 

  *lost*

  jeffro - again you are making assuptions about other people (Jw)

  based on what ? again, do not think i am disagreeing with you friend, we have had some passionates spats yes, because misunderstandings can so easily cause them things to happen, like when people form different cultures clash, they dont understand each other, becauset hey don't know each other. Strangers from different cultures.

  Yes, when you put it on paper

  Satan is God

  God is Satan. It looks a bit shocking.

  Abba, Father, The One True God, The Most High, The Almighty, The Creator who sent his Son to redeem us, has been given the personal name je-hova.

  We have discovered that the name je-hovah is not the persoanl name of the True God Most High.

  (now you don't believe there is a God, or any God's, which is fine, but, we are talking matters spiritual, things that people believe above all else. People love this Abba Father, The One True God, The Most High God, they love this Being more than life itself.

  To you it may be absurd, fine, but that doesn't mean it isn't so.

  But to Spiritual people, who believe things Spiritual, it has to be discessed through that channel.

  If I could have had this information months ago, it would of made a big difference. Why, logic, reason, evidence, facts, discussion. It makes a big difference when you can sit down with people and have an honest discussion, not debates, not fighting, not pushing rhetoric, not witnessing ridicule, piss taking and Hubris. That happens a lot on this site, there are some who just seem to 'get off' on it.

  I have had to take some shit off some people here and I have had to battle my way through it all to get to this information. The information presented in a way that I personally could understand it and digest it.

  JW's count Satan and his existence as real, every bit as much as they do God himself and Jesus. And Angels and Demons. Fact.

  It is not as simple as stating God is Satan, cos no he is not. Satan the master of deception - see, it's talking the language that applies to the person you are dealing with. If you do not know that person, it doesnt matter how many facts or bits of evidence you throw out there, true. It is how you package that information into a format which it can be dilvered in such a way as to make it digestable.

  Now I know these things, now I can see clearly, everything makes sense. Before it didn't. know I know why.

  The biggest most single thing that helped me was to be able to discuss these things with other people.

  If everyone knows this truth about the name je-hovah it's origins and meaning, why isn't the information shared. why is it os hard to find it.

  It is almost like it has been hidden.

  What else has been hidden, that is the thing, there si so much more out there.

  It doesn't always come down to belief's.

  regards
• 

  Band on the Run

  The overwhelming majority of Christians don't worship Abba, the Father. They worship the Trinity. God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. This emphasis on the OT God is not present in most strands of Christianity. Christ should be the central figure. I doubt that it is what the first Christians believed. When nonJewish people converted to Christianity, their concept of God changed.

  Jews worship the OT God, as interpreted through centuries of rabbinic thought.

  I understand your YHVH. Although I always suspected WT misconstructions, it was only when I read the Bible text alone that I saw the WT always lies. One single sound is beside the matter. It is similar to the cross v. stake dispute. Who cares? Well, I suppose if it is the first time you realize that the WT is NOT perfect, it is life altering. You can't put the genie back in the bottle.
• 

  *lost*

  Band - thank you for taking the time to talk about this.

  The reason I put Abba in there, is because it seems I have to go the extra mile to make the distinction between what we term The God and god/s.

  Some believe the Trinity, some don't, Catholics also venerate and Worship Mary, again we know the origins of that strand of the RC Church's teaching. And yes, Christ is supposed to be the central figure. I did notice with jw, the emphasis is on, supposedly God. Not Jesus. Which was kinda confusing. Also the constant teaching's and focus from the OT, there was more emphasis given I think on the OT rather than on the NT and Jesus.

  But now I know why. There are a lot of things I just don't worry about, then there are a lot of things that just don't 'sit' well. But you can't figure out why you feel uncomfortable about something. Of course then you've got the constant indoctrination.

  As you say you can't put the Genie back in the bottle. But, hey, I think it's a good thing. I would rather know this truth about je-hova.To think their whole house is built on paganism, when they bash the Church and everyone else and put themselves as this superior religion and using trickery and deception concealed under the banner of truth. lol. At least I now have peace of mind. i don't have guilt, or regrets, or confusion. Which to me is worth so much.

  If I couldn't come here and talk about it, I never would of known. I would still be in the vortex. At least I am free.

  There were so many things that made me feel uncomfortable. but I didn't know why. At least now I do.
• 

  Band on the Run

  I am happy for you. This forum has taught me so much. I was completely shocked about the UN and the Witness NGO status. Also, my knowledge of JW detainees in WWII concentration camps had no nuance until I read the infamous letter from Rutherford. When he threw Jews under the bus, he also threw Jesus under the bus. Of course, Jesus is so lowly in JW thought.

  What I still don't understand is why the Board of Directors did not challenge Rutherford's take over more vigorously. Someone suggested that the WT was just a dinky religion when it happened.
• 

  *lost*

  Band - if Satan rules the world, if false religion is his machine to control the masses, suppress them and suck up all that energy 'worship' and is getting his jollies at the same time, it makes perfect sense that he masterminded rutherford.

  Think on this. the world in the time of the Romans, the Greeks, The mid East + Eastern civilisations. they were very advanced.

  Then, the apostles pass away and BAM, Rome falls, RC Church is invented, missing books of the scriptures/hisrtory/information etc.

  Dark Ages. How does society go from advanced to backwards ?

  the the machine starts again, Age of enlightenment, Reformation etc.

  Remember, at one time you would be burned for owning a Bible. Why.

  Why is it so hard to find info out there on je-hova ? only the processed mush for the masses.

  regards
• 

  Crazyguy

  I to realized when i found flaws in our religion and not just mistakes but actual cover-ups and changes made to support their doctrine, that yes why wouldn't Satan use a religion that thinks of itself as so godly and accurate and so correct to fool even more people. Just the arrogance of our religion should be enough to warn people away, since Jesus was not like this.
• 

  *lost*

  crazyguy - i often wonder how people miss the bacis theme of the story, regardless whether one believes in God or not

  (plenty of Satan worship going on in the world ans nasty things, let's not pretend it doesn't)

  So the story does tell us about Satan, why he is, what he wants, what he does etc.

  Isn't this what we all know from our time with jws.
• 

  Jeffro

  *lost*:

  To you it may be absurd, fine, but that doesn't mean it isn't so.
  But to Spiritual people, who believe things Spiritual, it has to be discessed through that channel.

  No, you don't seem to understand. You're just wrong. It has nothing to do with my perspective about what entities exist. Your approach to semantics and etymology, and the non sequitur conclusions you draw therefrom are just wrong.
• 

  *lost*

  why so ?

  obviously I am not disagreeing with you, as I am learning all these things, the only way to learn is to research and ask questions, filtering out the finer things.
• 

  Jeffro

  why so ?

  Refer to my earlier posts. I'm not interested in continuing to go round in circles.