by 70wksfyrs 173 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
cofty,
Why do you think there is a need for a creator to explain things that are fully explained by non-supernatural means?
Ok cofty you got me there, I don't think there is a need for a creator. I just belive He exists, and until I learn something I am happy in my own little fuzzy la la land with my invisble friend Jehovah, who I am annoyed with at the moment I will add, beause he is ignoring me.
Yes this might sound like nonsense, I am still deprogramming aren't I
Take your time. It took me almost a decade.
When a purely naturalistic answer is found to this puzzle will it effect your belief in god, or will another unknown take it's place?
Good question cofty. The answer is I just don't know yet. We will have to wait and see. Stay tuned it will be a fun ride.
As a Jw child the proof and reasoning for gods existence was the complexity of living things and nature and the need for a mind to create such complexity.
i now no longer believe in god for several reasons:
Sccience explains fully how nature can become complex with no divine intervention,
Science explains how the universe can come from nothing
Science explains our makeup , behaviour, physiology, anatomy and matural history and that of many animals, this history negates a god and contradicts all holy texts.
The religious textdps from where the concepts of god originate are flawed, innacurate, written with ignorance, bias and unpleasant purposes.
Having searched for god and a theocratic theme in life, I sincerely find no evidence, as all believers do also. Only they see gaps in human scientific knowledge and call that gap a role for god, that is not evidence.
i had no eeasons to reject god or seek to reject him, it took me many years ti reach that desicion and i must admit the bible's ignorance and mistakes alongside the Watchtower lies concerning science and history helped me to become an atheist, but in all honesty I had a bigger desire to find evidence FOR a god than none.
i didn't give up god after watchtower, i then examine the bible. I didn't give up god following rejection of the bibiel, i looked at the Quaran ans read it and some hadiths, went to mosque a number of times. I examined buddhism, hinduism and at about this point realised that all these beliefs had common threads. Very human contructs and all required faith, whereas the science I was consuming all day in class didn't require faith, but simply eyes and ears and hands.... The evidence was real, you could see, hear and touch it.
Many religious people now drop the evidence for god argument and claim to have miraculous experiences of talking with god or interacting with him. I have heard of many of these from people in faiths, i have heard of people that claim they experienced demon attacks too. When i sat down and pondered how to reason through this I realised the simplest of things.... I ...me... i have never seen ANY of these things and NONE of these things have ever been recorded or captured or tested or induced beyond a private personal experience. The usual answer to that is a christian asking you how much you really asked jesus for guidance or help etc... I know how much i asked him, i know how much i sought truth.... I know how genuine I was and yet...nothing.
When i ask them to describe their experiences, they are always very flimsy, bizzare and weak tales of unexplained natural events. for example, hearing voices is a very common and natural event, as a trainee doctor with experience on an asylum rotation, I saw the reality of such NATURAL occurences.
even if i took their word that this happened, what use is that information..... What god do i then believe in been as people from all religions claim such events? Which god, which religion ? Do i rear my child in a belief system based on the word of someome else describing a very natural occurence such as hearing voices?
....so no...... I dont believe in god ;) x
sorry for the waffle..... I am busy alot of the time so i try to squeeze alot in and try to answer and q's people may ask when I am not around.
snare x
SBF and cofty,
Wonderful and terrific interchange. You had me in stitches hahahaha side splitting fun, I would believe you if you told me you staged it for my benefit great stuff.
Anyway in my view SBF is the winner yehay!!!! Good work cofty though.
snare,
Your apologies for waffle are duly noted. I am tired at the moment so all it is to me right now is waffle. But I will read your post properly when I get a chance.
Kind reagrds snare
look out for my real response soon
70wks...........
I don't on the premise that there's no practical evidence for support.
I do however understand why people (humans) both past and present do or have, its part of are sociological and psychological make up.
Science does not know what the divine is... to be able to measure it and state that it does not exist. Or even to be able to conclusively state that something happened without a divine 'hand'.
Science is silent on the matter of God... for now. Because science has not the tools to examine/measure/recognize the spiritual... yet. Effects of the spiritual yes, though this is often mis-attributed to various other causes... for now.
Peace,
tammy
Science has exposed and quantitatively revealed human ignorance as a plausible cause to why most human beliefs of gods/deities has existed
within the frame of human imagination.
cofty, what makes you think god has to be a tinkerer that has ever to involve herself in the workings of the accomplished work again?
jgnat and all: in the model of a 2 dimension, curved and expanding cosmos,
One spatial dimension is removed from the universe, but if you, in that MODEL
remove one dimension from GOD too, and why not?
he could be thought of as having left the room that contains us, that is filled with time and energy, shut the door behind and live happily ever after in the rest of his 4+ dimensional domain.
