LET THE EVIDENCE BEGIN (page 7)

Bang

Never been proven wrong?

"The Latter-Day Saints submitted to the decrees of Congress (1904) in regard to the anti-polygamy statutes, unwittingly admitting by their submission that the divine command in the revelation of their founder and prophet, Joseph Smith, to "re-introduce plural marriage and restore the polygamous condition", either did not come from God, or for them it was better "to obey man than to obey God".

Sometime after receiving the divine command, President Joseph F. Smith (April, 1904), endorsed by resolution and unanimous vote, officially stated. "....I hereby announce that all such marriages are prohibited...."

So much for the divine command - please explain.

Bang

QUANTUM

say bang

you don't know too much do you? you are refering to a situation that developed over a period of time. Plural Marriage was not illegal in this country when first practiced by the church. what ever ones personal feelings are about the practice is another issue. When the mormons moved to utah it was not a state but a territory...also no aw against plural marriage.

When the Government did pass laws against it many families were living as plural.....many in the church felt that no matter what the government said they were not going to submitt....after all they felt it was from God. only after the full power of the gov. came down upon the church did they relinquish. Why? 1. they did their best to live the commandments of God 2. God released them from the pledge 3. the scripture..render unto ceasar what is his is also a command. God established this country to be a bastion of freedom. No one except those who lived this law will understand it's full meaning....the church did not cave in ....they finally obeyed the law of the land, a law directed at them specifically. I wonder if such a law could be enacted today with the extreme prevalence of immorality contrary to Bible priciples...after all the law against plural marriage was because of what was viewed as Biblical Immorality. Today, multiple sex partners, marriages, homosexuality etc. etc. etc....is all accepted without hardly a peep of objection

Try to come up with something better

Quantum the pure!!

alamb

OK, I am a native Utahn, born and raised and I have concluded:

1. Along with the Smithsonian Institute who put a considerable amount of $ into looking for ruins, I want to see some evidence before investing any more interest into this faith.

2. As a person who lives my life at peace with others to the best of my ability, according to your own doctrine, I will go to the highest kingdom of heaven. On the other hand, as a jack-Mormon (as they are called who only go along because of the family traditions or the social status), I would go to a lower kingdom. It doesn't take a betting person to see the odds here and which is the better bet.

3. As a non-mormon, I get a 10% raise and Sundays off. An elderly woman locally whose parents were LDS but she never had chosen that path was recently approached by the little guys picking up the tithing at the first of the month (yes, they come to YOUR house!) and presented her with a bill for over $90,000. I cannot see God's hand in this.

Don't get me wrong, all my friends locally are LDS and I was the only non-LDS to graduate from my school district. The ceremony was held in the tabernacle by the way. They have a strong sense of family that is admirable and are very hospitable, but I am afraid, they are as duped as the rank and file JW on the street. Looking for empathy or sympathizers here is spitting in the wind.

Bang

Quantum the pure,

say bang, you don't know too much do you

the church did not cave in ....they finally obeyed the law of the land, a law directed at them specifically.

I'll admit that I didn't know that God released them from the pledge (and please excuse me for remaining suss on that one).

So what your saying now is not that it's "better to obey man than to obey God", but rather "better for God to obey man", albeit new light.

But hey, it was the full power of the government, right?

Bang

Edited by - Bang on 12 July 2002 2:31:36

QUANTUM

alamb:

I have sent people to where the evidence is but when it comes right down to it no one here really wants to know anything else.....The big bad wts ruined them for receiving any light and their is my resentment for the WTS ..because I have freinds whose brains have become mush because of them.....No one in good consciece can compare the LDS church and the WTS. We walk on opposite sides of the street. Where one is a prison the other a gift.

Q!

Bang

Quantum, come back. I understand that the government of the U.S. is very strong.

Bang

alamb

Quantum:

Yes, I know where you got your handle BTW. If you do have hard evidence, not just locations which I hear have now moved from the North American Continent to South America, you need to share them with archeologists. The Smithsonian wasted millions looking with no help from anyone like yourself stepping foreward.

There are major differences in the JW's and the Mormons, but the tactics are the same. I have friends who are scarred by the rituals they underwent in the temple....which are common knowlege here. My father was denied being on the local Basketball team unless he would pass sacrement in approved standing by the locals. The politics remain.

In high school the Mormon students are allowed to attend seminary an hour a day for the last 4 years of school. I asked, as a JW, for the same time to "pioneer" and receive religious training from my religion of choice as I had fulfilled my credits early my senior year. Request denied. I opted to attend college and H.S. simultaneously, but only while pioneering...the jw's here will understand that one. I also asked not to attend the graduation ceremony (I graduated with a 4.0 and was valedictorian) in the tabernacle as this violated my conscience. Request denied.

The same politics exist in the adult world here and the pressures are all here. Try being a non-Mormon here and running for political office or getting a job for which you are aptly qualified but must go up against a Bishop's daughter. It's the same game. Nothing Christian or God-given about it. "by their fruits you will recognize them........" the fruit is rotten here.

QUANTUM

please little girl.....your crocodile tears are wasted on me.....

There are many places in this country and around the world which might not be a good place to find employment for certain individuals for various reasons...so move on....blaming the locals for your problem is stupid. Why your parents forsed you to attend that particular school is their falt....my understanding that in utah you can attend any school you want........Being in an area where a particular church is dominant has it's draw backs for non members...the smat thing to do is leave...were your parents that stupid too!

QUANTUM GETTING TIRED OF CHILDREN STORIES

deddaisy

"...within 60-80 years this church will rank #3 among the world religions."

I know I'm impressed....maybe with a good advertising agency you could get right up there with the Catholic Church........

pseudoxristos

QUANTUM,

Smith said that he was able to translate this unknown language by the gift and power of GOD

If God was able to give Smith the ability to translate the plates, why didn't God just go ahead and give Smith the ability to write the book of Mormon with out them? He might as well have, because you can't produce them. What is the point of God making the plates if they can't be exhibited as evidence? Smith's fictional story of these non-existant plates is not convincing. You've been had. Go get your life back.

I'm still waiting on those Plates!!!!!!!!!!!

pseudoxristos

LET THE EVIDENCE BEGIN

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