Touchofgrey, what you are actually doing is establishing boundaries and rules for God. He used men to write down what is necessary under the guidance of His spirit. If you follow the scriptures you will see there is actually no contradictions. We either do not have all the facts or it's our because of our perceptive shortcomings. As a whole the scriptures is in harmony and furnish with what we need for the moment. This will become clear as we see the storm clouds over this world gathering. If you reject the scriptures it will be to your detriment.
What evidence is there for a biblical jesus?
by Touchofgrey 189 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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Touchofgrey
Vidqun
No I'm not there is no evidence for god ,so the bible is the uninspired word of man used as a means to control and manipulate people.
. If you reject the scriptures it will be to your detriment .
Why do you have to resort to threatening speak to make your point.
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peacefulpete
Vidqun....It always comes down to that. Quiet your mind, open your heart and believe or face the consequences.
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joey jojo
There seems to be a point where a seemingly rational person becomes irrational when it comes to faith.
If you are broadly the same religion as your parents, or identify as a member of your national religion, it means you accepted what you were told by parents and peers.
Believing a man named Jesus, Mohammed, or whoever once existed is one thing, but basing your way of life on it and insisting your children do the same is madness if you boil it down. Just because something is old doesn't make it right.
All of our parents made mistakes, they were not perfect and all-knowing. So why are they automatically right about the subject of religion?
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FreeTheMasons
@Vidqun said: If you reject the scriptures it will be to your detriment.
@Touchofgrey said: Why do you have to resort to threatening speak to make your point.
Vidqun's words weren't a threat. He was just stating the obvious.
If a person feels threatened by truth, it's because that "threatened" person's conscience is bothering them. It has nothing to do with the person who stated the truth, although the typical response from a person who is in denial is to blame the messenger.
If you feel "the point" maybe you should move out of the way of the sword.
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FreeTheMasons
@joeyjojo said: There seems to be a point where a seemingly rational person becomes irrational when it comes to faith.
If you are broadly the same religion as your parents, or identify as a member of your national religion, it means you accepted what you were told by parents and peers.
Believing a man named Jesus, Mohammed, or whoever once existed is one thing, but basing your way of life on it and insisting your children do the same is madness if you boil it down. Just because something is old doesn't make it right.
All of our parents made mistakes, they were not perfect and all-knowing. So why are they automatically right about the subject of religion?
You make sweeping assertions that are incorrect and then you attempt to build on them. That type of building work does not stand.
In my personal experience, I was not raised reading the Bible. I read Anne Rice. I had extra schooling in ancient Egyptian religious teachings from a young age. I learned about Canopic jars and The Book of the Dead way before I learned the first book of the Bible was Genesis. (I didn't know the first book of the Bible was Genesis until I was 24 years old. To me, Genesis was a band with Phil Collins.)
As a youth, I lived for a time in the Salem Massachusetts area and learned a lot about witchcraft. We watched a lot of spiritistic and violent entertainment growing up. That was what I learned about, not the Bible.
Mythology, fantasy, immorality and violence were what I learned about growing up.
It wasn't until later in life that I really learned about Jehovah and Jesus and the Bible. My mom had been around the Watchtower when I was very young, but we didn't go all the time, and then she was disfellowshipped when I was about seven or so years old.
Anyway, my point in sharing that is that your logic doesn't pan out. Ancient Egyptian mystery rites are old, and as you said, just because it's old doesn't make it right.
But at the same time, the earth is old and it is real. The sun is old and it is real. Jesus is old and he is real. Jehovah is outside of time and He is more Real than anything on this earth or in this universe.
Not all of our parents made mistakes. Jesus has never made a mistake, and he came to stand in Adam's place as our first father. If we are wise, we will look to him for truth. He's never lied to anyone.
Have you?
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peacefulpete
We are no longer discussing 'evidence' and that is ok. No one begrudges you the freedom of religion.
If however, I were to ask if you believe Jesus wears a toga, a golden crown and rides a white horse while swinging a sword, you probably would tell me no, that's symbolism and metaphor. Yet if I ask if Jesus wears a toga riding a donkey and stabbed with a sword, you will insist, yes, that is real. If one depiction is spiritual metaphor, why could not the other? You shared that ominous picture because for you it is powerful. Myth is powerful. There is nothing sacrilegious about understanding the Gospels as dramatization/metaphor. It is just a different conceptualization of Christianity than you are accustomed to.
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FreeTheMasons
@peacefulpete -
Perhaps you have read this verse before:
"A revelation by Jesus Christ, which God gave him, to show his slaves the things that must shortly take place. And he sent his angel and presented it in signs..."
What exactly are these "signs"? They are word pictures.
In a court of law, how is evidence presented? Most evidence is presented in words.
Words are a form of "signs." Language itself is not "tangible" in the same way that physical items you can touch are tangible. You can measure sound and speed and inflection, but the way language works is by symbolizing something else.
I can tell you you're about to be run over by a bus, but if you don't want to heed the warning, it doesn't matter how much I tell you about the evidence I've seen. If you want to stand in the road, you're going to stand in the road.
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peacefulpete
They are word pictures.
Absolutely. And word pictures/myths are powerful. That is the core. If you have a message, hard to understand, use word pictures and story. If the Gospel writers wished to convey their conviction that the Christ had been a mystery woven through the OT, how better than to use scores of OT references as story elements. At the same time link it to contemporary events and offer an explanation for the loss of the Temple and the rites.
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joey jojo
FreeTheMasons
Mythology, fantasy, immorality and violence were what I learned about growing up.
There, you just proved my point. That's what you were taught. Your beliefs haven't changed. It's just a different book.