On Blaming God...

by AGuest 135 Replies latest watchtower bible

ashitaka

No matter what, this is a question we cannot answer until we see God for ourselves, if He exists at all. No matter what points we debate, we were not at any of these biblical events, we have not seen miracles, and we cannot grasp God, even if he was within our own hearts. I think that leaving the question open, that being open minded is what God really wants, if He's up there at all.
I think, that if God exists, he smiles on us when we question Him, because it's exactly what He would do if we were in his place.
If that's the case, then the NOW is what's important, not some ancient book, it's contents, or the very pliable walls of faith.
ash
noko

Well God gave Cain a chance to repent and to come back to him, if not Cain would die anyways. Abel will be resurrected, Cain may have killed the flesh of Abel but did not kill the spirit of Abel which will be brought back by God. Cain did serve a life sentence here on Earth til death, while Abel will be brought back from death for eternal life. God's justice is much higher then man's justice is the point here.
teejay

...people make all KINDS of assumptions... because of a lack of INFORMATION.

Don't people make assumptions because of mis-INFORMATION, also? Yes, I think they do.
I attempted to give you some HISTORY… some BACKGROUND… some TRUTH… so as to help you put things in a proper perspective.

Too bad Cain didn't have that HISTORY... that BACKGROUND... that TRUTH, eh? I bet Abel wished Cain had!
And while obviously it did nothing for YOU… I am sure that some have come a much better understanding because of it.

Let's hope so, but I have serious doubts that it helped any. I could be wrong, though.
I find it quite interesting that... it is Cain’s “plight” ( which turned out MUCH better than Abel's) that you have an issue with.

No. I have no issue with Cain's plight. Actually, I think he made off like a bandit! More than anything, I simply have a fascination that god would allow one of his sons to get away with murder, turning a blind eye to it, as it were.
Why did god PROTECT "murderous" Cain? -- teejay
I absolutely answered your question, and the ENTIRE Law... both the Old Covenant and the NEW Covenant... "sheds light" on it: He did so for the SAME reason He did not hold the errors of Moses, David, Saul of Tarsus, Peter and others against them: mercy. And I not only stated that, but gave you verses to support it. Did you read them? If you had... you have "seen" your answer. -- AGuest

So god, under the law of Moses, forgave murder. Wow. This is the one time that I'm interested in seeing scripture and verse.
Cain did murder his brother. The unwritten law of your god demanded justice, yes?
Depends. On what? On whether there was a request for mercy, which is a "higher" law.

So, unless you have some sort of proof, you assume that Cain "requested mercy"... was repentant. I see. So, if someone commits a heinous crime -- even murder -- and requests mercy in the same way Cain did, god has set the precedent for letting them off. Might explain the shape of the world we're living in, eh? Why god isn't doing anything. He's simply being "merciful."
Do you understand what mercy IS?

Yes, I think so. Probably not as well as you, but yes... I understand the concept.
Cain… did not DESERVE the kindness shown to him… but he received it nonetheless. Undeservedly so. Mercifully so.

Indeed he did NOT deserve mercy but got it just the same, and without asking for it! Unless there is a verse somewhere that says he did ask for mercy. Or infers he asked for it. If so, I've never read it. care to share it with me? I might need to copy after Cain one day. You know... before the Judgment Seat...
I would say “hear… and get the sense of it,”… but I truly think it would be... moot.

You'd be right. I will not get the sense of it quite like YOU get the sense of it. But that's cool. You're still cool iwth me.
Take care, Shelby, my friend. Holla.
UnDisfellowshipped

Teejay said:
THE POINT IS THAT THEY BOTH BROUGHT AN OFFERING – ONE BEING REJECTED, THE OTHER ACCEPTED.
The fact is god showed callous, unloving, judgmental favoritism toward his two sons, neither of whom had the fortune of learning from past generations what the unseen deity required. Pleasing him was a matter of trial and error. Much like, it would seem, god's parenting skill.
You definitely could not have gotten that information from any Bible that I have read.
The Bible says this about Cain and Abel:
Updated King James Version:
Genesis 4:2: And she again bare his brother Abel. And Abel was a keeper of sheep, but Cain was a tiller of the ground.
Genesis 4:3: And in process of time it came to pass, that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the LORD.
Genesis 4:4: And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the LORD had respect unto Abel and to his offering:
Genesis 4:5: But unto Cain and to his offering he had not respect. And Cain was very angry, and his countenance fell.
My Comments: I am pretty sure that Cain and Abel did not just come up with the idea of giving sacrifices to God on their own. I believe that God had told them to make sacrifices (just like God did under the Mosaic Law).
Genesis 4:6: And the LORD said unto Cain, Why are you angry? and why is your countenance fallen?
Genesis 4:7: If you do well, shall you not be accepted? and if you do not well, sin lies at the door. And unto you shall be his desire, and you shall rule over him.
My Comments: God warned Cain, and told him that if he did not change his wicked ways, that sin would take him over.
Genesis 4:8: And Cain talked with Abel his brother: and it came to pass, when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother, and slew him.
My Comments: Cain ignored the warning, let sin take him over, and then murdered his brother.
Genesis 4:9: And the LORD said unto Cain, Where is Abel your brother? And he said, I know not: Am I my brother's keeper?
Genesis 4:10: And he said, What have you done? the voice of your brother's blood cries unto me from the ground.
Genesis 4:11: And now are you cursed from the earth, which has opened her mouth to receive your brother's blood from your hand;
Genesis 4:12: When you till the ground, it shall not henceforth yield unto you her strength; a fugitive and a vagabond shall you be in the earth.
Genesis 4:13: And Cain said unto the LORD, My punishment is greater than I can bear.
Genesis 4:14: Behold, you have driven me out this day from the face of the earth; and from your face shall I be hid; and I shall be a fugitive and a vagabond in the earth; and it shall come to pass, that every one that finds me shall slay me.
Genesis 4:15: And the LORD said unto him, Therefore whosoever slays Cain, vengeance shall be taken on him sevenfold. And the LORD set a mark upon Cain, lest any finding him should kill him.
Genesis 4:16: And Cain went out from the presence of the LORD, and dwelt in the land of Nod, on the east of Eden.
My Comments: God's punishment on Cain was:
1: Cain had to be a fugitive and vagabond for as long as he lived.
2: Whenever anyone saw Cain, they would try to kill him.
3: The earth would not bring forth its strength for Cain (in other words, he would not be able to brong forth good vegetables from the earth anymore).
4: Cain was to be "hiding from the face of God." I believe this means that Cain was banished from the presence of God.
5: God, for whatever His own reasons were, decided to let Cain live on for however long he lived.
I personally do not know whether or not Cain was repentant, because the Bible does not say.
God can show mercy to whoever He wants to for whatever reasons He wants to. God allows His sun to shine on the wicked and the righteous.
Notice these Verses:
Matthew 5:44: But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
Matthew 5:45: That all of you may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he makes his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust.
Matthew 5:46: For if all of you love them which love you, what reward have all of you? do not even the publicans the same?
Matthew 5:47: And if all of you salute your brethren only, what do all of you more than others? do not even the publicans so?
Matthew 5:48: Be all of you therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.
Luke 6:27: But I say unto you which hear, Love your enemies, do good to them which hate you,
Luke 6:28: Bless them that curse you, and pray for them which despitefully use you.
Luke 6:29: And unto him that strikes you on the one cheek offer also the other; and him that takes away your cloak forbid not to take your coat also.Luke 6:30: Give to every man that asks of you; and of him that takes away your goods ask them not again.
Luke 6:31: And as all of you would that men should do to you, do all of you also to them likewise.
Luke 6:32: For if all of you love them which love you, what thank have all of you? for sinners also love those that love them.
Luke 6:33: And if all of you do good to them which do good to you, what thank have all of you? for sinners also do even the same.
Luke 6:34: And if all of you lend to them of whom all of you hope to receive, what thank have all of you? for sinners also lend to sinners, to receive as much again.
Luke 6:35: But love all of you your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and all of you shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil.
Luke 6:36: Be all of you therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful.Luke 6:37: Judge not, and all of you shall not be judged: condemn not, and all of you shall not be condemned: forgive, and all of you shall be forgiven:
Luke 6:38: Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that all of you mete likewise it shall be measured to you again.
Why does God show mercy and allow wicked people to live for a while? I will let the Bible explain:
2nd Peter 3:8: But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
2nd Peter 3:9: The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.2nd Peter 3:10: But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
Also, why did God not accept Cain's offering? I will let the Bible explain:
Hebrews 11:4: BY FAITH Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaks.
Hebrews 11:6: But WITHOUT FAITH it is impossible to please him: for he that comes to God MUST BELIEVE that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
1st John 3:10: In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever DOES NOT RIGHTEOUSNESS IS NOT OF God, neither he that LOVES NOT HIS BROTHER.1st John 3:11: For this is the message that all of you heard from the beginning, that we should love one another.
1st John 3:12: NOT AS CAIN, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? BECAUSE HIS OWN WORKS WERE EVIL, and his brother's righteous.
Teejay said:
So god, under the law of Moses, forgave murder. Wow. This is the one time that I'm interested in seeing scripture and verse.
God did indeed forgive REPENTANT murderers.
Here are the Scriptures which show this:
God forgave the REPENTANT Manasseh:
2nd Chronicles 33:1-17: Manasseh was twelve years old when he began to reign, and he reigned fifty and five years in Jerusalem: But did that which was evil in the sight of the LORD, like unto the abominations of the heathen, whom the LORD had cast out before the children of Israel. For he built again the high places which Hezekiah his father had broken down, and he reared up altars for Baalim, and made groves, and worshipped all the host of heaven, and served them. Also he built altars in the house of the LORD, whereof the LORD had said, In Jerusalem shall my name be for ever. And he built altars for all the host of heaven in the two courts of the house of the LORD. And he caused his children to pass through the fire in the valley of the son of Hinnom: also he observed times, and used enchantments, and used witchcraft, and dealt with a familiar spirit, and with wizards: he wrought much evil in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger. And he set a carved image, the idol which he had made, in the house of God, of which God had said to David and to Solomon his son, In this house, and in Jerusalem, which I have chosen before all the tribes of Israel, will I put my name for ever: Neither will I any more remove the foot of Israel from out of the land which I have appointed for your fathers; so that they will take heed to do all that I have commanded them, according to the whole law and the statutes and the ordinances by the hand of Moses. So Manasseh made Judah and the inhabitants of Jerusalem to go astray, and to do worse than the heathen, whom the LORD had destroyed before the children of Israel. And the LORD spoke to Manasseh, and to his people: but they would not hearken. Wherefore the LORD brought upon them the captains of the host of the king of Assyria, which took Manasseh among the thorns, and bound him with fetters, and carried him to Babylon. And when he was in affliction, he besought the LORD his God, and humbled himself greatly before the God of his fathers, And prayed unto him: and he was implored of him, and heard his supplication, and brought him again to Jerusalem into his kingdom. Then Manasseh knew that the LORD he was God. Now after this he built a wall without the city of David, on the west side of Gihon, in the valley, even to the entering in at the fish gate, and compassed about Ophel, and raised it up a very great height, and put captains of war in all the fenced cities of Judah. And he took away the strange gods, and the idol out of the house of the LORD, and all the altars that he had built in the mount of the house of the LORD, and in Jerusalem, and cast them out of the city. And he repaired the altar of the LORD, and sacrificed thereon peace offerings and thank offerings, and commanded Judah to serve the LORD God of Israel. Nevertheless the people did sacrifice still in the high places, yet unto the LORD their God only.
God forgave the REPENTANT David after he had committed adultery with Bath-sheba and intentionally had Bath-sheba's husband killed in war:
2nd Samuel 11:14-27: And it came to pass in the morning, that David wrote a letter to Joab, and sent it by the hand of Uriah. And he wrote in the letter, saying, Set all of you Uriah in the forefront of the hottest battle, and retire all of you from him, that he may be smitten, and die. And it came to pass, when Joab observed the city, that he assigned Uriah unto a place where he knew that valiant men were. And the men of the city went out, and fought with Joab: and there fell some of the people of the servants of David; and Uriah the Hittite died also. Then Joab sent and told David all the things concerning the war; And charged the messenger, saying, When you have made an end of telling the matters of the war unto the king, And if so be that the king's wrath arise, and he say unto you, Wherefore approached all of you so nigh unto the city when all of you did fight? knew all of you not that they would shoot from the wall? Who stroke Abimelech the son of Jerubbesheth? did not a woman cast a piece of a millstone upon him from the wall, that he died in Thebez? why went all of you nigh the wall? then say you, Your servant Uriah the Hittite is dead also. So the messenger went, and came and showed David all that Joab had sent him for. And the messenger said unto David, Surely the men prevailed against us, and came out unto us into the field, and we were upon them even unto the entering of the gate. And the shooters shot from off the wall upon your servants; and some of the king's servants be dead, and your servant Uriah the Hittite is dead also. Then David said unto the messenger, Thus shall you say unto Joab, Let not this thing displease you, for the sword devours one as well as another: make your battle more strong against the city, and overthrow it: and encourage you him. And when the wife of Uriah heard that Uriah her husband was dead, she mourned for her husband. And when the mourning was past, David sent and fetched her to his house, and she became his wife, and bare him a son. But the thing that David had done displeased the LORD.
God forgave David because David was REPENTANT:
Psalm 51:1-19: To the chief Musician, A Psalm of David, when Nathan the prophet came unto him, after he had gone in to Bathsheba. Have mercy upon me, O God, according to your loving kindness: according unto the multitude of your tender mercies blot out my transgressions. Wash me thoroughly from mine iniquity, and cleanse me from my sin. For I acknowledge my transgressions: and my sin is ever before me. Against you, you only, have I sinned, and done this evil in your sight: that you might be justified when you speak, and be clear when you judge. Behold, I was formed in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me. Behold, you desire truth in the inward parts: and in the hidden part you shall make me to know wisdom. Purge me with hyssop, and I shall be clean: wash me, and I shall be whiter than snow. Make me to hear joy and gladness; that the bones which you have broken may rejoice. Hide your face from my sins, and blot out all mine iniquities. Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me. Cast me not away from your presence; and take not your holy spirit from me. Restore unto me the joy of your salvation; and uphold me with your free spirit. Then will I teach transgressors your ways; and sinners shall be converted unto you. Deliver me from blood guiltiness, O God, you God of my salvation: and my tongue shall sing aloud of your righteousness. O Lord, open you my lips; and my mouth shall show forth your praise. For you desire not sacrifice; else would I give it: you delight not in burnt offering. The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, you will not despise. Do good in your good pleasure unto Zion: build you the walls of Jerusalem. Then shall you be pleased with the sacrifices of righteousness, with burnt offering and whole burnt offering: then shall they offer bullocks upon yours altar.
wonderer2003

Cain did serve a life sentence here on Earth til death, while Abel will be brought back from death for eternal life.

Why does the above sentence by :noko: annoy, disturb,and scare me.
It angers me that we waste so much of our brief time in quests that are not directly involved with enjoying life.
We know how evolution works, and "tinkering by a deity" is not part of the equation. To me, it diminishes the spectacle and beauty of our world whenever someone says, "God did it". The fact that God did not do it makes it all the more interesting and marvellous.We are all enormously lucky to be alive.
So God is here letting the world do it's own thing and the people and animals do their own thing,
So what's the difference between that and a God that does not subsist.
AGuest

peace to you, my brother... and... well... all I can say is that you seem to be having difficulty with something that does not make sense... to YOU. I think the primary reason for that is that you wish to see only your "way" about it. But the saying is that "there are two sides to every story".
I ask you: why is so difficult to assume that God has HIS reasons for doing what He does... things that may be far beyond understanding (for some of us)? I can tell you: one of THE most difficult things for us... earthling man... to do is to let go of our own paradigms, as given us by other earthling men... and think BEYOND. Even when we think we have ("I DON'T think LIKE the WTBTS anymore."). Well, we may not think LIKE we used to, but we may still think AS we used to.
(LOL! My Lord warns that the "evolutionists" are going to jump on that one, but to make the reply that it is they who follow the teachings of earthling man, as well as the "religionists" - but there are those of us who follow the teachings of God, through Christ. The difference? It is not "we"... who are right, but God.)
For some of us... because we exist ONLY in flesh... anything beyond what is fleshly, empirical... evidenced, experienced and realized BY the flesh and its senses... does not truly exist. However, for others of us... because we exist in flesh AND SPIRIT... there is indeed more: an entire world beyond this one... and much more a reality than this. And by means of such spirit... WE... experience and realize THAT one... as well as this one.
It is for this reason that I love the movie the "Matrix", as many others do for whatever reason. MY reason is that all that APPEARS "real"... SEEMS "real" because our PHYSICAL senses TELL us that it is "real"... is not necessarily so. REALITY... is whatever WE... perceive. Since most ONLY perceive a physical reality... ONLY experience a physical reality... that is all they are capable of knowing. They can KNOW nothing else... because they can PERCEIVE... experience... or realize... nothing else.
To me, however, EVERYTHING that I have seen and hear... is "real" to me... and that of the spirit world even MORE real... because I HAVE experienced it and realized it. And it answers ALL of the questions of THIS world... while THIS world... CANNOT answer a single one of that one's... other that seeing God's TRUE qualities... in the physical creation.
"We" always run around daring people to have an "open" mind. Yet, in TRUTH... for most of us... our minds... and more importantly our HEARTS... exist "closed". Tightly shut against anything that is not of our understanding, and certainly not of the physical world. Even more, anything that is not of this earth. If it is not of "our kind" or "our sort"... earthly... it either does not exist... CANNOT exist... or is condemned. What arrogance. Sort of like Europeans and white Americans from the past 2-3 centuries: "if it don't look... or talk... or THINK... like us... kill it. It ain't real... no, it ain't HUMAN... therefore, it has no right to exist. Because WE say what does and does not... what can and cannot... exist."
I am not asking you or anyone here to be ignorant, Teejay. Far from it. I am not asking that you believe in a fairy tale. I am not asking that you believe... anything. What YOU believe to be true... is entirely up to you. Even if that belief... is false.
What I AM doing... is telling you the truth: what it is... and how I know it; from whom. Whether you and others hear... or refrain. The truth that I tell you flies in the face of the "truths" you have previously been told, however, by "religion"... because THEIR "truth"... is a lie. THEIR "truths" are based on fairy tales... because, at a minimum:
1. They have angels with wings like that of a bird... why? Because you all can "handle" that...
2. They have my Lord looking tall and strapping and handsome... why? Because you all can "handle" that... (some have even gone so far as to make him blonde-haired and blue-eyed, which we should all KNOW is a lie... and yet...)
3. They have my Father as some unmerciful, despot tyrant, running around creation meting out horrible punishments and judgments, making contradictions and condemnations... why? Because THAT... is how WE are... how WE treat our fellowman...
There is SO much that is "written" that is MISSING... that it most certainly plays into the hands of earthling man to have what still exists. By means of it... he can CONTROL... and in many cases ANNIHILATE... his fellowman: particularly those who do not THINK as he does.
MY job, then, is like my Lord's: to bear witness... TO THE TRUTH!
None of these things are correct, but are lies... with the last one the GREATEST lie... and the MAIN means that the Adversary uses... not to draw people TO God... but AWAY from God! If my Father were truly as EARTHLING MAN has delineated Him to be... WHO would want to serve Him? WHO would want to live under such a yoke?
And it was BECAUSE of such lies... that my Lord CAME... in the FLESH: to bear witness... to the TRUTH. And if you look at HIM... and how HE lived... how HE treated people... then you see how GOD... really is! NOT how religious leaders... and the "false stylus" of the scribes... have portrayed Him to be. And yet, even these, although SEEING him... SEEING his works... and continually trying to TRICK him into judging and condemning others... as THEY had... eventually killed him. Why? Because he was FALSE? No... because he WAS TRUTH. And... they HATED the truth... because it exposed THEM as not being what THEY were portraying themselves as: representatives and sons of God, by means of Abraham.
You get angry, Teejay... because you do not know God. But... you also do not wish to KNOW Him. How do I know? Well, first... so many here SAY it: "I don't WANT to know God." for whatever reason. But also, because you absolutely REFUSE to do it... by means of the WAY He said it could be done! You have chided Him, ridiculed Him, challenged Him, confronted Him... but you have NOT... "approached" Him. Why? Because you have NOT... gone to Christ. You have NOT even attempted to gain access... through the Door.
And until you DO... you will remain OUTSIDE... where the dogs and practicers of spiritism are, where the fornicators and murderers and idolaters are... and where everyone LIKING... and carrying on a LIE... is. That you are... is entirely your CHOICE.
For the Door stands OPEN... the call is still going out. For the Spirit and the Bride... even down to this day... KEEP saying:
"COME!"
To everyone HEARING, everyone THIRSTING, everyone wishing... the call is:
"Come! Take 'life's water'... FREE!"
That you don't... is on you.
This is my 'holla', Teej... perhaps you will 'holla' back. We'll see.
As always, I bid you the greatest of peace.
YOUR servant,
Shel
Realist

aguest,
i have a question...the voices you hear are they just pleasant or is it annoying frightening at times? would you like to keep hearing these voices or would you be happy if they stopped?
hurt

Well God gave Cain a chance to repent and to come back to him, if not Cain would die anyways. Abel will be resurrected, Cain may have killed the flesh of Abel but did not kill the spirit of Abel which will be brought back by God. Cain did serve a life sentence here on Earth til death, while Abel will be brought back from death for eternal life. God's justice is much higher then man's justice is the point here.
So do you understand God's justice? Easy to conclude God's justice is higher than man's. Fine. But does man understand that justice. Just how just is it to have made Adam's offspring suffer for something he did? You understand it? How is that near anything like justice?And if Cain served " a life sentence here on Earth" where's the justice is leaving him dead, right after Abel is made alive again?
AGuest

...the voices you hear are they just pleasant or is it annoying frightening at times?

I hear many. I listen to one.
There is one that tries to frighten, because he just thinks that for the most part we are ALL quite stupid and weak and will give in to fear, if not selfishness. So, from time to time, he tries to use fearful things. But that doesn't work with me anymore... so he has not used such a tactic in quite some time. Years, actually. He feels that as a spirit being, he himself is quite superior to us... that earthling man primarily a "joke", in general. There are many among them that feel this way and because they ARE powerful, use every means to exploit those they consider "weak"... us... humans... every second of every day. And unwittingly, most of us let them; in fact, many of us play along. And it is all quite a humorus joke to them.
It is worthy to note, however, that they... are the minority. So many more of them are NOT like that and are, in fact, "rooting" for us. THEY know what happened, how we came to BE "weak"... Adam... and they empathize with us. That is why they have no problem helping out when they are asked to... when they are sent. Because they are spirits, they are sometimes allowed to see past our flesh, to our spirit, if JAH permits. They have no problem being in subjection to Him... or being fellow slaves of US... because they, too, love.
would you like to keep hearing these voices or would you be happy if they stopped?
I am quite fine with them as they are, and cannot imagine my life with such... silence. I have no objection to any of them, for by means of them I have come to know a great many things (i.e., how they TRULY are, how they feel... about us and other things... what THEIR hearts are like, and more). For the most part, spirit beings are... wonderful. They are not like us at all, but quite "clean"... which means they do not have hatred IN them... for anyone. In fact, MOST of them exist... for the very purpose of serving God, Christ... and us. And they carry that existence quite willingly... happily.
It is the few who think us an error... and themselves the "superior" creation... who are the trouble. THEY think that THEY should "inherit" the kingdom... and not weak, sickly, hateful man. They are of the wicked "princes" of the spirit world... the wicked spirit forces... those given "principalities" over which they were to watch and serve. Public servants. But rather than remaining servants... they wish to BE served... by means of their perceived superiority.
Fortunately, they are not superior to the SON... and that one bought US... those of us who wish to BE repurchased... the One who WILL inherit the kingdom... and has lovingly and graciously offered to share that kingdom with US. Since WE belong to HIM... if we indeed DO... and HE is stronger and superior to THEM... THEY... have NO power over us.
I love the voice of my Lord... and even though my flesh sometimes grows weary at the response I receive from earthling man when I share what I hear... I cannot imagine NOT wanting to hear it.
May you have peace.
A slave of Christ, to time indefinite,
SJ
teejay

... you seem to be having difficulty with something that does not make sense... to YOU. I think the primary reason for that is that you wish to see only your "way" about it. But the saying is that "there are two sides to every story".
why is so difficult to assume that God has HIS reasons for doing what He does... things that may be far beyond understanding...

It's a flaw of mine, Shelby. I can only see something as I can see it. If god does something that is beyond understanding, then I would hope that he'd be forgiving for my lack of understanding. Perhaps you should, too?
Based on human limitations, I've tried to see things from god's vantage point. So far I am unable to justify some (a lot) of what that one does. When discussing these types of issues with me, please always bear in mind that, unlike you, I am working at a severe disadvantage: god doesn't talk to me and never has. Not one syllable in four and a half decades. For that reason, when it comes to understanding his personality and possible motives, I'm limited by what he (purportedly) said and did as recorded in the bible.
To me, however, EVERYTHING that I have seen and hear... is "real" to me... and that of the spirit world even MORE real... because I HAVE experienced it and realized it. And it answers ALL of the questions of THIS world... while THIS world... CANNOT answer a single one of that one's...
See what I mean? Everyone has not experienced the same thing. You have "seen" the spirit world. I have not. One would think that you would speak with me with that understanding in mind, rather than your usual (and constant) condescension.
"We" always run around daring people to have an "open" mind. Yet, in TRUTH... for most of us... our minds... and more importantly our HEARTS... exist "closed". Tightly shut against anything that is not of our understanding, and certainly not of the physical world.
I take it that you directed that comment at me? If so, I accept it (although I feel it totally unjustified). Try as I might, I cannot fathom things that are beyond my ability to fathom. I know you might say, as you have in the past, that my failure to understand the deity lies with me, and I accept both your rebuke of me as well as whatever it is you say I lack in not being able to see or hear god. Maybe one day...
I am not asking you or anyone here to be ignorant, Teejay. Far from it. I am not asking that you believe in a fairy tale. I am not asking that you believe... anything. What YOU believe to be true... is entirely up to you.
I believe what is truth TO ME, Shelby. Don’t you? If I deem something as being either out-rightly false or simply unsubstantiated, then so be it. I would expect the same of you. Do you ever say that god has spoken to you when you know full well that he hasn't?
You get angry, Teejay... because you do not know God.
Do you really believe that? That I'm angry with god? (rhetorical questions) No, I'm not angry with god. OTOH, I don't make excuses for what I see as his mistakes, either
But... you also do not wish to KNOW Him.
Could it be even slightly possible, Shelby, that the judgments you have pronounced upon me here (and in other threads) are totally wrong? In your assessments of me, can you truthfully say that you are, without a doubt, perfectly accurate?
Some here on this board have treated you—in my view—most disrespectfully. They have called you names... said you are mental... even "dangerous." Have I? No. I have never—not once—made such judgments of you. Whenever I address you, I do so as an equal, with every bit as much respect for you as I render to any other poster on this board, despite the fact that I generally disagree with your "god" posts.
That being the case... why, I ask, do you repeatedly make belittling judgments of me as you have throughout this thread... judgments that are so often condemnatory in nature?
How can you be so sure about what I want to know... of where my heart is? The very fact that I engage you in dialog (albeit as an unbeliever) should give you some sort of clue. Sadly, you never get it.
What says your god about your condemnatory, judgmental attitude?

On Blaming God...

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