" our future kings the governing body "
Theyre on that track to putting the governing body on a pedestal with Christ.
Ten reasons Jehovah’s Witnesses have the true religion (plus a bonus one)
by slimboyfat 62 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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FreeTheMasons
" our future kings the governing body "
Theyre on that track to putting the governing body on a pedestal with Christ.
They did that a long time ago...
Christ is having them pushed down off that pedestal.
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slimboyfat
StephaneLaliberte this is also a subject I have taken an interest in.
The only real difference was the numbers—there were many more Catholics, and therefore many more traitors and Nazi sympathizers, but the ratios were likely similar.
The ratios are entirely dissimilar. The overwhelming majority of JWs resisted the Nazis whereas only a small number of Protestants and Catholics did so. This is why the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum describes Jehovah’s Witnesses in the Third Reich as:
an island of spiritual resistance to the Nazi demand for absolute German commitment to the state.
Whereas it concludes its article about Protestants and Catholics this way:
After 1945, the silence of the church leadership and the widespread complicity of "ordinary Christians" compelled leaders of both churches to address issues of guilt and complicity during the Holocaust—a process that continues internationally to this day.
https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/the-german-churches-and-the-nazi-state
Note the contrast between “an island of spiritual resistance” and “the widespread complicity of ‘ordinary Christians’”.
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peacefulpete
From the second link:
The Bekennende Kirche—the "Confessing Church"—emerged in opposition to the “German Christians.” Its founding document, the Barmen Confession of Faith, declared that the church's allegiance was to God and scripture, not a worldly Führer. Both the Confessing Church and the "German Christians" remained part of the German Evangelical Church, and the result was a Kirchenkampf, or "church struggle" within German Protestantism—an ongoing debate and struggle for control between those who sought a "nazified" church, those who opposed it, and the so-called "neutral" church leaders whose priority was the avoidance both of church schism and any kind of conflict with the Nazi state.
Interestingly, the majority of Catholic and protestant leadership assumed a position of "neutrality" They neither sought to support nor oppose the government, but did what was thought necessary for the continuation of their way of worship.
It is worth noting that JWs being targeted also wasn't because of opposing the Nazis, it was because of the nature of the church. Many suffered because of direction from Brooklyn that defined just what they could and could not do. What I mean is that no doubt many would have been left alone had they simply individually interpreted the salute as a formality, similar to standing before a judge, as many of other faiths where free to do. The hierarchal nature of the religion deprived them of that choice. I have never read that it was outspoken opposition to the antisemitism of Nazism, for example, that resulted in being targeted.
It ought never be forgotten that it was the individual convictions of Catholic and Protestants in the resistance and the Allied armies that saved the JWs.
If anything, WW2 demonstrates the dangers or neutrality and the danger s of hierarchal controls over morality.
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a watcher
No one is a future king until they've received their final seal.
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slimboyfat
… WW2 demonstrates the dangers or neutrality …
If everyone was neutral there would have been no war, obviously, but you’re entitled to your opinion, notsopeacefulpete. Your entire post is a whole lot of cope, attempting to downplay the stand JWs took in Nazi Germany.
Protestant historian Detlef Garbe described the conduct of JWs in the Third Reich as a “ray of light in a dark age”. The United States Holocaust Memorial Museum called JWs “an island of spiritual resistance”. Former JWs who attempt to deny reality on this do themselves no favours. It’s a sign of being in a bubble. Not everything about JWs is bad. If you can’t straightforwardly recognise opposing the Nazis as a good act it’s maybe time to reflect.
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FreeTheMasons
No one is a future king until they've received their final seal.
All of the 144,000 have their final seal at this point.
Jesus wasn't king yet in 1914, but Revelation shows that the plagues don't start until after the 144,000 are sealed.
The plagues in Revelation are figurative. The war, pestilence and famine are figurative of Jehovah sieging and plaguing the religious institutions and then the corrupt governments. The "blood" shows their bloodguilt. The "hail" is pelting them with truth that exposes the lies. The "stars falling" is the religious leaders falling from their positions and self-made-glory. They're getting exposed and shamed. The plagues include when the governments associated with the UN strip the of their financial assets and dissolve their hierarchies.
These things are happening now. We are in that time now.
Which is why we know Jesus is king now and the 144,000 are all sealed. None of the 144,000 have gone to heaven yet though.
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Konagirl
@FreeTheMasons – “Jesus wasn't king - yet - in 1914”
Is that the 1914 Wt. doctrine with a twist?
Jesus was a ruling, active king in the first century.
Matt 21:5 - “Tell the daughter of Zion,
‘Behold, your King is coming to you,
Lowly, and sitting on a donkey,
A colt, the foal of a donkey.’ ”John 1:49 - Nathanael answered and said to Him, “Rabbi, You are the Son of God! You are the King of Israel!”
Luke 10:19 – “Behold, I give you the authority to trample on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy, and nothing shall by any means hurt you.”
John 18:36-37 - Jesus answered, “My kingdom is not of this world. If My kingdom were of this world, My servants would fight, so that I should not be delivered to the Jews; but now My kingdom is not from here.” Pilate therefore said to Him, “Are You a king then?”
Jesus answered, “You say rightly that I am a king. For this cause I was born, and for this cause I have come into the world, that I should bear witness to the truth. Everyone who is of the truth hears My voice.”
Luke 11:20 - "If I drive out demons by the finger of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.”
Luke 17:20-21 - Now when He was asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, He answered them and said, “The kingdom of God does not come with observation; 21 nor will they say, ‘See here!’ or ‘See there!’ For indeed, the kingdom of God is within you.”
Mark 15:2 – Then Pilate asked Him, “Are You the King of the Jews?” He answered and said to him, “It is as you say.”
John 17:1-2 - Jesus spoke these things, looked up to heaven, and said, “Father, the hour has come. Glorify your Son so that the Son may glorify you, 2 since you gave him authority over all people, so that he may give eternal life to everyone you have given him.
Matt 28:18 - And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.”
John 16:33 - These things I have spoken to you, that in Me you may have peace. In the world you will have tribulation; but be of good cheer, I have overcome (conquered) the world.”
John 5:21 – “And just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, so the Son also gives life to whom he wants.”
Luke 22:69 - "But from now on, the Son of Man will be seated at the right hand of the power of God."
Psalm 110:1-2 -
The Lord said to my Lord,
“Sit at My right hand,
Till I make Your enemies Your footstool.”
2 The Lord shall send the rod of Your strength out of Zion.
Rule in the midst of Your enemies!Heb 1:1-3 – “God, who at various times and in various ways spoke in time past to the fathers by the prophets, 2 has in these last days spoken to us by His Son, whom He has appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the worlds; 3 who being the brightness of His glory and the express image of His person, and upholding all things by the word of His power, when He had by Himself purged our sins, sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high”
2 Pet 1:3 – “as His divine power has given to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of Him who called us by glory and virtue”
Heb 2:14 – “Inasmuch then as the children have partaken of flesh and blood, He Himself likewise shared in the same, that through death He might destroy him who had the power of death, that is, the devil,”
1 Cor 15:25,24,26 – “For He must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet.
Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power.
The last enemy that will be destroyed is death”
Rev 1:18 – “I am He who lives, and was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore. Amen. And I have the keys of Hades and of Death.”
I can provide more if you like. Surely you can see the power and authority Christ had while on earth, and after his resurrection. But can you provide scriptures that show Jesus didn’t begin reigning until or after 1914, (whatever you meant) sitting idle in heaven and waiting for men to designate a date that fits nicely in with their false doctrine?
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LV101
Always interesting re/JWs resistance to Nazi regime -- are Jewish people today aware of this? I'd received such negative comments in the past from couple Jewish people re/JW religion and perplexed why they'd undermine/ignore JWs' historical position. Most likely they're unaware or because of other WT doctrine. Comments were from older ones not young and ignorant of history. I really don't think most people are knowledgeable of JW's persecution for their faith during this genocide.
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peacefulpete
Slimboy...That was very insulting and completely inaccurate. The suffering and loss of the Jews the JWs as well as the Roma, the gays, and many others was a dark chapter that can never be repeated. Analyzing what went wrong for this to have happened leads me to conclude that, at least in part, the lack of vocal and resolute opposition to the propaganda and hate speech of the Nazi party on the part of the churches enabled the cancer to grow. The WT like other churches first attempted to placate Hitler and convince him they were no threat to him. For the WT it didn't work. The WT's antigovernment message was well known.
The sad reality is that if the churches, including the WT, had unitedly opposed the message of Hitler people would have listened. Their "neutrality" was wrong. Today, when we hear similar hate speech from individuals or authority figures we also have a responsibility to respond. Neutrality is an illusion; you are either against wrong or you are complicit. And yes, that includes use of force when absolutely necessary. If the WT allows a person to use force to defend family and church members, their choice to not do the same for their neighbor is not because of an objection to violence, it's a result of disconnect from society.