Dateline--Fahrenheit 911 (page 12)

L_A_Big_Dawg

Exdub,

Hopefully I can say what I want to say with the understanding that this is not an "ad hominem" against Moore.

Moore, is either ignorant or stupid, with his statement about "flying around" in Air Force 1. The plane is about as secure as it gets. I seriously doubt that it flies anywhere without fighter escort now, and especially that day. I mean come on if Moore is so smart, why does he make a moronic comment like that?

Moore then makes a derogitory remarks about blacks, inferring that the are violent. Now, I am asking you to be honest with yourself, if this statement had been made by, say Limbaugh (who was fired from ESPN for stating that he thought Donovan McNabb was "over-rated"), Hannity, or any other right-wing person had said this the "media" would have been all over them.

These things don't "scare" me, what they do is make me wonder why there is an apparent double standard within the media when it comes to people like Moore. Now I know that you accused me of"crying" about this yesterday, however the question still remains, why the apparent double standard?

LABD

Edited to add: So what if President Bush stayed and continued reading with the kids at the school on 9/11? If he had left in a hurry I'm Moore would have criticized him for leaving and causing panic in those children.

Yerusalyim

EXJ,

Look at the lies Moore told in Bowling for Columbine...one example...opening scene, he's in a bank and acts like he's getting a gun just for opening an account...what he doesn't show because of slick editing is that he was there for over 90 minutes, that an FBI background investigation was run vis a vis the required photo ID, none of which Moore showed...that is, essentially, a lie. His movies are full of this kind of nonsense.

So, did Bush continue to read, HELL YES, so as not to scare the kids, GEESH. Richard Clarke approved the Bin Laden's being flown out of the US, he personally vetted them. What is sad is you see this as analysis and not propaganda. moore is free to make these comments, irresponsible as they are...but Moore even said this movie is INTENDED to be anti Bush and justify the statements he's made in the past. This is NOT an unbiased work, nor is Moore Unbiased. He doesn't show facts in context, and when it suits him, he makes up facts.

joenobody

I find it pretty shocking to see the difference between many of the Bush supporting Americans on this thread versus the comments from those of us outside the country that have access to a different perspective with additional news services. Your country and government owes you a lot of answers - why aren't more people asking the questions?!?

berten

>Look at the lies Moore told in Bowling for Columbine...one example...opening scene, he's in a bank and acts like he's getting a gun just for >opening an account...what he doesn't show because of slick editing is that he was there for over 90 minutes, that an FBI background >investigation was run vis a vis the required photo ID, none of which Moore showed...that is, essentially, a lie. His movies are full of this kind of >nonsense.

So he edits out the 90 min. waiting time.This documentary is about 120 min. Did you really expect that those 90 min.

of waiting time should be included in the final print? Do you really think that the viewer can't come to the conclusion that

it might have taken a bit longer (90 min+ , so he *did* walk out of this place *with* a gun,the *same* day ! ).

And you call this a "Lie"? "Nonsense"? Read a book on documentary making...

rem

berten,

Well, somebody is lying. Whether it be the lady that gave him the gun or Moore, I'm not exactly sure. Her version of events are quite different than Moore's. She claimed that the scene was staged and that guns are not normally handed out at the bank. She says that it was a special situation that they agreed to before hand because of the movie. Unfortunately I cannot confirm her side of the story, so I'll just have to keep an open mind about it.

rem

Simon

Look at the lies Moore told in Bowling for Columbine...one example...opening scene, he's in a bank and acts like he's getting a gun just for opening an account...what he doesn't show because of slick editing is that he was there for over 90 minutes, that an FBI background investigation was run vis a vis the required photo ID, none of which Moore showed...that is, essentially, a lie. His movies are full of this kind of nonsense.

So, you start the DVD and watch 90 minutes of waiting ...

Don't be daft! We know it's edited to take the delay out and it's explained on the movie. The fact is he is handed a GUN ... in a BANK.

Really yeru ... is that the best you could come up with?

avishai

I find it pretty shocking to see the difference between many of the Bush supporting Americans on this thread versus the comments from those of us outside the country that have access to a different perspective with additional news services. Your country and government owes you a lot of answers - why aren't more people asking the questions?!?

It's funny, so many people think that because I am anti michael moore that I am pro-bush. I also have access to other news sources. It's called the internet. I listen to the bbc radio, ozzie news networks, etc. I also read Al-Jazheerah. I'm not a big fan of Bush, either. But Michael Moores lies DO NOT HELP!!! Look at it this way. Liberals who watch the film are of no use politically, because he is preaching to the converted. If he wants to truly help, then he's preaching to those who don't already know these things. Lying DOES NOT HELP those sitting on the fence, as it were. It makes a credibility gap to where, even if 99% percent of it is true, the lies poison the rest of the well. And it makes all the rest of his info. suspect.

dolphman

Simon,

I don't remember M. Moore mentioning an FBI check . He SKEWED the situation through editing to make it seem he walked into a bank and walked out 10 minutes later with a gun. THAT IS A FICTION PORTRAYED AS FACT. I don't think his point would've been dramatic enough if he'd shown an FBI check in progress. And you know what? He was right. It's the little lies and half truths that add up to a big ol' stank load of PROPOGANDA. Leftist are not immune from it.

exjdub

Moore, is either ignorant or stupid, with his statement about "flying around" in Air Force 1. The plane is about as secure as it gets. I seriously doubt that it flies anywhere without fighter escort now, and especially that day. I mean come on if Moore is so smart, why does he make a moronic comment like that?

That's exactly the point LABD! Michael Moore may make statements that are personal opinions or are ignorant, but the point is: Why do his critics call him on the carpet for making what perhaps may be a stupid comment, but avoid the major things that are wrong with our President and/or our government. The things that you guys make a stink about amount to nothing compared to the accusations leveled at Bush by Michael Moore. It lends a great deal of legitamacy and support to Moore's point of view when you attack the little things rather than the real issues.

I say these things, not to argue, but rather to have someone show me where Michael Moore has lied, particularly in connection with some of the weightier accusations that he has leveled at our government. What may come as a surprise to you and Yeru is...I am trying to keep an open mind. If Moore has lied about some of the troubling things about Bush, show me, so that I have the opportunity to re-evaluate my position.

Thus far all that has been shown (if it is accurate) is that Michael Moore has said some stupid things and that he waited 90 minutes in a bank for a gun but edited a 120 minute film so that it does not reflect the full 90 minutes. Which by the way, whether or not Moore disclosed the fact that it was "only" 90 minutes or not, don't you think that is an awful short period of time to be able to get your hands on a gun? If that is the best you have got then I am still a Michael Moore fan and believe much of what he has to say.

So, did Bush continue to read, HELL YES, so as not to scare the kids, GEESH. Yeru,

If the President interrupted his reading sessions and calmly said that he was sorry but that he needed to attend to some important business and then left, are you telling me that the kids would have been scared?? Come on...that is a lame excuse. But I guess your right, a classroom full of scared kids is much more important than our country being under attack. Our President, bless his little heart, is always looking after the little ones...puleeeze.

Richard Clarke approved the Bin Laden's being flown out of the US, he personally vetted them. What is sad is you see this as analysis and not propaganda.

prop·a·gan·da (pr
n.

The systematic propagation of a doctrine or cause or of information reflecting the views and interests of those advocating such a doctrine or cause.
Material disseminated by the advocates or opponents of a doctrine or cause: wartime propaganda.

You have already admitted that the event happened. What part of it is propaganda? It happened, it's fact. It's not analysis and it sure ain't propaganda. It does raise some questions, though, doesn't it?

exjdub

L_A_Big_Dawg

Exjdub,

Don't you think that a guy that can't get and keep his facts straight doesn't deserve to be listened to?

Or is it that your HATE of President Bush was clouded your judgement?

Or is it my dislike of Moore's politics have clouded mine?

Either way, how many times does someone have to be wrong before they no longer have credibility????????????????????????????????????

LABD

Dateline--Fahrenheit 911

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