EX JW who are now Born Again Christians? (page 8)

Gill

LT and Ozzie - Now there's the problem that I'm having with this whole 'experience' thing. It reminds me too much of the 'feeling' or 'experience' people are meant to have when they feel they belong to the 144000, in JW land. To me that strikes as a sudden surge in seretonin levels that is perhaps brought on by relaxing too much or excess 'joy'. More a chemical brain reaction.

Now, with respect, in saying this I am not knocking or meaning to knock anyones experiences.

How does someone KNOW they've been Born Again? From BAs that I know, I'm sorry but I'm gonna be straight here, I get the 'cringe factor tingle up the spine' when they start on 'how they were filled with joy and the holy spirit'.

When they've been to 'charismatic dos' and they tell me they've seen the lame walk, the blind see and the dead rise, as one preacher did the other week, I have to fight the urge to smack them around, and ask them what they've been smoking recently.

Why can't Christians just say I'm a christian and be done with it. Being Born Again just sounds....for a start bloody painful...but daft.

I'm not trying to make a joke out of other peoples religious beliefs here. I...well to me... a life long ...until recently...witless fool...I've heard so much daftness that I now want to actually know where and what all this stuff means. I have a very bad habit of taking the piss...and I'm sorry if I come across that way...but I've only in the last few years been Born Again myself...in that I've actually become me instead of brain dead JW.

Sorry if I strike a chord of irritation in any BA's...you see...I write BA and want to fall about laughing again. Must be too much tea this morning.

Anyway, sorry if I've offended any one.

But what is this Born Again experience?

(Whoops, here I go again)

LittleToe

Gill:The experience is subjective.
For some, they just walk around calling themselves Christian. For others they have an "experience".

In my own case it was the latter, and I did indeed claim to be of the 144k (though I felt mighty uncomfortable with the notion, especially given the WTS doctrines surrounding it - this was one factor that caused me to question them). When I left I found it was far more common-place in Christian circles (and ironically, I found it also occured outwith Christian circles, too!).

You may wish to write these things off as self-induced hysteria, perhaps in part due to your personal "cringe factor". It's a free country - you may even deride such things. However that doesn't make you right, in and of itself. Lack within your own experience doesn't negate it's reality. IMHO you'd have to be pretty bigotted to say that it does...

Edited to add:It's been said that if two experiences are related to be exactly the same, the chances are that one of them is a lie. This should highlight the subjective nature of them.
In my own case I never get into the details of mine, in a public forum. If you've seen how much these subjects get belittled you'd have half a clue why...

Gill

Absolutely! I can see how much these things get belittled. I find my own reaction to them interesting and that's why I would like to understand what it is people are saying when they talk about this 'experience'. As I've already said, my experience of BA Christians is perhaps not the best to have. They remind me a lot of extreme JW behaviour in their need to literalise everything.

I accept that I do suffer from this 'cringe factor' and as I also said, a very bad habit of taking the piss of almost everything. That's why I'm trying to find out a little more. BAs around me make me want to 'run for the hill' because of their, what I can only call 'wild expressions of faith' that they need to come out with constantly. As if, if they didn't keep making these expressions their faith could be in doubt.

But I'm afraid that reminds me too much of being a JW. You must go to all these meetings, and field service and studies, or else your faith is at risk . For example, we're walking home from school, me and the BA minister, and he's off about the Tsunami and it being God's work to warn the wicked that he will soon step in. Closet JW or what. We're walking home from school, people are driving using their mobile phones. They tell me God can see these people and they will suffer for their actions. I really have to bite my lip and shut up, (and not fall about laughing).

I do not want to belittle. That's just my naughty side, giggling all the time. But I just don't understand why they're all so similar to the JWs.

Sorry for any offence as I said previously.

ozziepost

I recall writing this next point on many occasions in posts here, so here we go again!

In all the circles I mix in amongst christian believers of many types, I rarely, if ever, recall anyone saying to me they were a born again christian as if it were some label. If I were to ask them, sure, they'd say they were 'born again' but it seems to me that these labels which some, (especially in the USA?) like to wear are nowhere in the experience of christians in other places. Nor do we see the agressive tendencies to proselytise as some posters here, agnostic though they may be, claim is the character of christians everywhere.

In short, Merry Cans especially have often fallen into the trap of viewing all sorts of things from their own experience and perspective as if this were the "world view' when in truth it's far from it. The USA may well have a certain experience of people bearinga label of BA christian who conduct themselves in a particular way. That doesn't have to hold true for the world at large.

The problem is that a country, great as it is, which conducts a sporting tournament which they label the "World Series" but which noone else competes in, falls easily into the snare of delusion.

Now right now Mrs Ozzie and I are enjoying a magnificient Merlot. It has a Burton label - now that is a world series!!!

cheers, Ozzie

Gill

Oh, and I would not 'negate the reality' of someone elses experiences just because I have not experienced them myself.

You see, I honestly believed that all that I was taught as a JW was true. I believed it and it was my experience that it must be true. I can't help being at the point of doubting everything. A bit like a blind person who thought the stairs were on the left and then found out they weren't when she crashed into the wall. Does that make sense? I'm sort of looking for the stairs. They weren't where I expected. So, I can't help feeling that there are also a lot of people out there who think 'the stairs were on the left' and are wrong.

Gill

Ozzie - I love Merlot....my favourite! Yum!

LittleToe

Gill:

They remind me a lot of extreme JW behaviour in their need to literalise everything.

Sadly a great number of them can be found in Fundamentalist-type religions. May I assure you, however, that this is not the sum totality. The quieter ones you would be unlikely to know about, which perhaps is part of the explanation as to why you see BA in such a light
To be frank, I find the more voluble ones embarrassing.

As for the JW-thing. It's surprising to see how many people, who were never associated with the JWs, have similar tendancies. Some things are very "human" preoccupations, IMHO. Maybe we're just a little sensitive to them, given our background.

No offense taken - that's pretty hard to achieve

LittleToe

Ditto to Ozzie.

The chances are that my flirtatious nature embarrasses the heck out of some of my Christian friends on this board. Nonetheless, I am who I am, and have never been called to account for it.

Gill:
In some houses the stairs are on the left

ozziepost

To be frank, I find the more voluble ones embarrassing.

A groan a day keeps despair away, eh?

Gill

LT - Maybe in some houses the stairs are on the left but how do you know if you're blind that you haven't stumbled across the step ladders that someone left out and you're on your way to no where, or worse....the door to the cellar was left open and you're on your way DOWN!?

EX JW who are now Born Again Christians?

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