Did anyone realise that this was the case when they became a witness or just realise through time that this is the societies teaching on it?
Each year i get annoyed at the memorial when the Speaker giving the talk always refers to this point and then says how the other sheep (the great crowd) "can benefit from this arrangement".
evergreen
JoinedPosts by evergreen
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24
Jesus: the mediator of the anointed (only)?
by evergreen indid anyone realise that this was the case when they became a witness or just realise through time that this is the societies teaching on it?
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each year i get annoyed at the memorial when the speaker giving the talk always refers to this point and then says how the other sheep (the great crowd) "can benefit from this arrangement".
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evergreen
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48
How I discovered the true face of the Governing Body!
by Khufu ini live in brussels, belgium.
i became a witness at the age of 18. my parents were not quite happy.
my father forbade me to attend more than one meeting a week.
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evergreen
Hi, Phillipe,
It all sounds like the poverbial iron fist in velvet glove stuff, The kind of treatment John May and Martin Merriman received when they tried to straighten out the matter concerning Ray Franz (Crisis of Conscience). Like you they flew across the atlantic ocean to speak to their "Spiritually anointed Brothers" to simply understand why Ray Franz was disfellowshipped for eating a meal with a dissasociated person. Not only were they treated badly in america, they were then subjected to a practical witch hunt when they returned back to Ireland.
I am just about to read the letter you sent to Bethel concerning the blood issue. I had an experience a number of years ago. My child had to undergo quite a big operation and although it was very unlikely that blood had to be used , i still had some very sleepless nights. The surgeon told us that only 99% of the time they did not use blood. But then i thought what if it was that 1% chance that was needed. i wasnt about to take any chances. I spoke to a HLC member and he told me that all i could do was emphasise to the Surgeon that he not use blood , but to leave it at his discretion as he could get an award of court. I couldnt belive my ears when he told me this as it is not mentioned at the meeting or in the publications about this. So i had to go through sleepless night s sweating about 'what if', when in fact this is the case.
I personally do not use a blood card and never will. When i go to hospital i write down 'Christian' as my religion and also follow the same rule as i did for my child. -
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How about this one ?
by Free ini was visiting some friends from out of state that had moved there from my hometown.
when one of the friends that was from their cong.
( pioneer ) said they wanted to get their time started before are 4 hour trip to a national park walked into a supermarket to hand out a tract.
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evergreen
lol, had to laugh when i read this thread. Now thats what you call the pioneer spirit
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9
Is it a case of; the more you know, the more disillusioned you become?
by jambon1 ini really feel that if you have had any kind of responsibility in the org then you are more likely to start becoming disillusioned.
having an appointment exposed me to all sorts of things that i simply would`nt have known about had i not been in that position.
anyone concur?
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evergreen
I think there are three types of people that go to the meetings.
The ones who were brought up in it who just view it as the faith they were brought up with and go out of tradition and accept what they are taught.
The ones who enjoy the power thing, who may know a lot of stuff that is skew, but could never give up their position as an outstanding member of the congregation.
The ones who are sincere whether brought up as a J dub or those who sincerely studied and became one but are plagued wth doubts about many things. Many of these are for what ever reason are still attending, and others who eventually decide enough is enough and stop attending.
I would have to say that probably, it is the case that the more you read paticularly the older publcations can have an affect on you . I always remember reading an older book. I think it was "let your Kingdom come" which went into the explanation of the king of the north and king of the south. I sincerely wanted to understand the prophecy on this. I read the book about 3/4 of the way through and thought this is pure nonsense. But put it down to Jehovah shedding new light in newer publications etc. So yes after a while , like a slow jigsaw puzzle. you start piecing many of these doubts together and remember them when you eventually come to the conclusion that there is something seriously not right here.
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Thinking out the box - how long did it take you?
by jambon1 inwhen i studied, i believed it all.
you know, not only the new system stuff but all the things relating to how bad 'wordly education' is, elders deserve our unequivocal support, apostates are evil, etc etc.
it must have been about 2 years into my love afair with the org that i began to have serious misgivings about the conduct of elders.
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evergreen
Hi Jambon1 ,
I was an absolute zealot for about the first year. I started thinking out the box, when first an MS siad that wearing a beard was equivalent to walking into a KH with a pony tail. (i had a very tidy beard at the time). Then an elder approached me a few weeks later to say that J dubs dont really wear beards and went into his speal about grooming etc. I was totally stumbled at this point and it was just before i got baptized.
The other thing that i quickly found was, i was stuck in the house week in and week out. All my old pals were out at the weekends and here was me drinking cans of beer in the house, which was something i never did before. (bad\associations etc) I resented not being able to go out and being a small congregation in a small town at the time, there was no "brothers" i could go out with for a qiuet drink. So i would say that it took me about a year and a bit when i first began to have some "nagging"doubts. The beard thing has always been an issue with me from the beginning.
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19
English Soccer. Will England win the world cup?
by MARTINLEYSHON inthe simple answer is no.
but i had a funny text from an irish friend that said the following:.
"the govt has done a survey on the size of an english penis.
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evergreen
"Obvious jealousy from your Irish friend me thinks - they are not even participating are they?"
Hey south african beef, have to say i found the comment about the white flag and the red cross quite funny. Yeah i guess we Irish havent made the world cup this time unfortunately. But hey, we beat England to win the triple Crown at Rugby. So that will do us for a bit.
But what i would say being totally serious is that if England want to do well in the world cup, they are going to have to step up a gear big time. I mean did you see that goal by Brazil last night , it came out of nowhere. Some of the teams are really tidy and just flow with the ball.
I would put my money on Brazil or Argentina to win. -
evergreen
Well, it depends what you mean. I can think of a few "bustbody" elders that could take you down a peg or 2 with a look. One elder in my old hall was as rigid as they come. You couldnt break wind without him saying something about being spiritually mature.
You had to watch every P and Q when in his presence. His prayers at the end of the bore meeting lasted about 4 minutes and his talks were about as riveting as watching tortoises race across a field. -
36
Remember the Panorama programme on JWs a few years ago? Question
by evergreen inyes, many will remember the panorama programme shown on channel 4 (uk) a few years ago.
the one that highlighted the child abuse scandal and the disgusting manner in which the borg deals with it.
then when the letter was read out to the congregations a week or so later addressing this issue by dismissing the programme by simply saying that two witnesses were needed before a person could make an accusation.
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evergreen
Two things that always stick out in my mind about the panorama programme and the letter read out after in the congregation was
1/ The dismissive attitude that the Elders had when the reporter was trying to ask them questions about the allegations. That ludicrous adoptive way, passed down from the GB of course to not answering the media. It just made the witnesses look even more guilty and cultish looking in the eyes of the public.
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2/ How on this earth could a small child ever convince the elders that they have been abused. Cant the society realise that in most cases the abuse takes place when the adult is alone with the child. The letter that was read out annoyed me so much and i am sure that many witnesses felt the same.
Even a relative of mine who works in social care and is a staunch J Dub said that if a child made such an allegation at her place of work. The social workers are straight in to deal with the matter. Even she, an out and out witness was shocked by the panorama programme. -
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Remember the Panorama programme on JWs a few years ago? Question
by evergreen inyes, many will remember the panorama programme shown on channel 4 (uk) a few years ago.
the one that highlighted the child abuse scandal and the disgusting manner in which the borg deals with it.
then when the letter was read out to the congregations a week or so later addressing this issue by dismissing the programme by simply saying that two witnesses were needed before a person could make an accusation.
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evergreen
Yes, many will remember the Panorama programme shown on channel 4 (uk) a few years ago. The one that highlighted the child abuse scandal and the disgusting manner in which the borg deals with it.
Then when the letter was read out to the congregations a week or so later addressing this issue by dismissing the programme by simply saying that Two witnesses were needed before a person could make an accusation.
What were your thoughts at the time? (anyone)
What did you think about the programme that had been shown?
If you were rank and file at the time , did it shock you?
Did you view yourself as being quite spiritually strong at the time but then suddenly find yourself having serious doubts about the borg because of this programme? -
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Was the straw that broke the camels back, the workload?
by jambon1 ini realise that there are many reasons for people leaving the org and some are very sensitive and difficult to discuss.
but i was wondering how many people, if they really think about it, were finally broken by the sheer workload as a jw.
someone replied to my thread yesterday (page 2), and discussed the average week for most jw`s.
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evergreen
Hi jambon 1.
The work load was far too much. Some people may find it ok, but when you are in the thick of it week after week, talks, preparation, study, ministry. It tires just about everyone out after a while. Whats more to me it always felt like "All work no play.............."
Also what about children. A childs natural desire is to play. But hey, thats up to mum and Dad because there is nothing "formally arranged" to suit the needs of witness children. No special events, no fun activities to cater for their active little lives as they are growing up. No, the important thing is that they are stuck in doors studying with mum and dad instead of mixing with those wordly kids having fun outside, they attend all the boring meetings and act like robots, and of course get out in the ministry as often as they can.
Boy is it any wonder they end up leaving feeling quite bitterwhen they grow up.
I think the society should review what Jesus meant when he said "my yoke is kindly and my load is light".
Ps interesting topics keep it up
Evergreen