Well, it is hypocritical for them to condemn people who celebrate christmas when they were celebrating it at bethel when they claim to have been selected by Jesus as the only true religion back in 1919. That being said, I don't expect them to change their minds on this anytime soon.
StephaneLaliberte
JoinedPosts by StephaneLaliberte
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13
JWs and Christmas
by Rnadomchris83 ini have been lurking around here for years.
i'm not a witness, but my in-laws are.
my wife grew up in it but was never baptized.
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The abuse of JW org
by wozza inawhile ago i said on here i would like to show how wrong the jehovahs witness organisation is , in that they will not accept the testimony of a victim of sexual crime where the victim has no other witnesses to the crime.
i faced this with helping my ex wife for about 15 years in exposing her father , an elder, to the jw org.
his raping of her over years and they believed him.. so therefore the perpetrator knowing of the organisations stance can easily deny and therefore be free to pretend to serve as an innocent jw still mixing with the congregation ,and also i have witnessed an accused perpetrator of child molestation witnessing at my next door neighbors house in field service with a child of another family even though the elders knew of the accusations against him.
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StephaneLaliberte
the deliberate weaponization of the rule. - Vidiot
But, they DO NOT WANT THE AUTHORITIES INVOLVED. - Biahi
The weaponization happens when they don't get the police involved and Biahi is 100% right! Before, the elders could literally disfellowship someone who reported the abuse to the authorities.
Since 2019, however, they've updated their policy to instruct elders not to prevent anyone from reporting abuse. Clearly, they wrote this because, before, they actually did prevent victims from reporting!
Since 2019, they changed the rules instructing elders not to prevent anyone from reporting abuse. This change shows they used to actually prevent victims, through disciplinary actions, from going to the police!
Also, that change doesn't go far enough. Elders can still talk victims out of reporting. One elder might not say anything, but another might pressure the victim to safeguard Jehovah's reputation and see their experience as some holy martyrdom!
The elders aren't capable, either physically, legally or competently to collect the necessary evidence. - Anonymous
They should alert the police and let them investigate, then base their actions on what that investigation reveals. - TonusOH
Absolutely right!
Way I see it, the problem at its core is not the two-witness rule, but how JWs do involve the police or, for the very least, advise the sexual abuse victims to do so.
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The abuse of JW org
by wozza inawhile ago i said on here i would like to show how wrong the jehovahs witness organisation is , in that they will not accept the testimony of a victim of sexual crime where the victim has no other witnesses to the crime.
i faced this with helping my ex wife for about 15 years in exposing her father , an elder, to the jw org.
his raping of her over years and they believed him.. so therefore the perpetrator knowing of the organisations stance can easily deny and therefore be free to pretend to serve as an innocent jw still mixing with the congregation ,and also i have witnessed an accused perpetrator of child molestation witnessing at my next door neighbors house in field service with a child of another family even though the elders knew of the accusations against him.
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StephaneLaliberte
I noticed that two people downvoted my comments. Could you explain why?
I mentioned that I agree with the "two or more witnesses" rule and emphasized that physical evidence should also count as a second witness. Considering that, since recent years, JWs also accept witnesses to seperate events, I really don't see the problem with my position.
Are you suggesting that, for example, if a stepdaughter accuses her stepfather falsely, you would automatically believe her without requiring corroborative evidence or a second witness?
This kind of blind belief is exactly why innocent people sometimes end up spending decades in jail!
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The abuse of JW org
by wozza inawhile ago i said on here i would like to show how wrong the jehovahs witness organisation is , in that they will not accept the testimony of a victim of sexual crime where the victim has no other witnesses to the crime.
i faced this with helping my ex wife for about 15 years in exposing her father , an elder, to the jw org.
his raping of her over years and they believed him.. so therefore the perpetrator knowing of the organisations stance can easily deny and therefore be free to pretend to serve as an innocent jw still mixing with the congregation ,and also i have witnessed an accused perpetrator of child molestation witnessing at my next door neighbors house in field service with a child of another family even though the elders knew of the accusations against him.
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StephaneLaliberte
I, for one, agree with the JW's position of requiring more than one witness to convict someone of a crime. However, I also consider physical evidence, such as videos and DNA testing, to be acceptable forms of witness. I'm not sure the JW agree with this.
As for Deuteronomy 22:25-27, it is part of the Mosaic law, which was superseded by Christian teachings in 2 Corinthians 13:1. In my opinion, the latter is superior in this instance. If you respect the Mosaic law so much, then you would agree with the idea of marrying a rape victim to her rapist, as stated in Deuteronomy 22:28-29.
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Canada exploring changes to tax rules that exempt religious organizations
by Scully inhttps://www.christianpost.com/news/evangelicals-oppose-removal-of-tax-status-in-canadian-proposal.html.
the proposed change will revoke charitable status of canadian churches who have an anti-abortion position, and will not give tax exemptions to organizations whose sole claim is to promote religion, which is the basic claim for all jw related entities in canada.
this will be interesting!.
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StephaneLaliberte
Harm people more than they do benefit them.
Although I believe they were harmful to me, I must admit that my parents do better within the JW community than they do outside of it—and they genuinely tried! Both of them were separately disfellowshipped, and they weren’t doing better then than they are now.
I believe that specific harmful teachings, shunning in particular, should not be allowed though as this goes against the very freedom that non-for profit organization benefit from and is actually harmful to the public.
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Canada exploring changes to tax rules that exempt religious organizations
by Scully inhttps://www.christianpost.com/news/evangelicals-oppose-removal-of-tax-status-in-canadian-proposal.html.
the proposed change will revoke charitable status of canadian churches who have an anti-abortion position, and will not give tax exemptions to organizations whose sole claim is to promote religion, which is the basic claim for all jw related entities in canada.
this will be interesting!.
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StephaneLaliberte
As much as I don’t agree with religions in general, they do meet the requirements for non-profit organizations:
- Being organized for a purpose other than generating profit for their members (e.g., educational, recreational, cultural, or charitable).
- Operating for the benefit of the public or a specific community.
If you take that away from religions based on opinions, you’ll also take away people’s ability to form communities and organize. It infringes on their freedom.
On the other hand, I believe that specific hate speech should be identified as such and be dealt accordingly, case by case. For instance, the practice of shunning, or when you hear one religious group call for the demise of other groups.
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I've done it: Christmas Lights Outside
by StephaneLaliberte inlets see if that causes a problem.
i've been inactive for a very long time now (like 10+ years), so, i don't expect to hear anything from it, but my parents are worried i'll get df.
lets see what happens.
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StephaneLaliberte
Romans 6:16 Don’t you realize that you become the slave of whatever you choose to obey?
Yes, that is true. You're a slave to the Watchtower. The Watchtower instructs you to hate the holidays, and so you do.
How so? Had you been a JW before 1928, you would have been celebrating Christmas as well. Based on your theology, celebrating Christmas wasn't a deal breaker for Jesus when he selected the JWs as the true religion in 1919. By enforcing a rule like this, JWs are acting like the unforgiving servant from one of Jesus's parables (Matthew 18:21-35).
As for us, once we leave, we have the choice to abide by our own conscience! For the last 10 years, I chose not to have any lights on my house. This year, I am choosing to have lights. It's my choice. The "world" doesn't care about it. All my "worldly" friends don't care about it. One way or another, my friends respect my choices. So, who's a slave to whom?
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I've done it: Christmas Lights Outside
by StephaneLaliberte inlets see if that causes a problem.
i've been inactive for a very long time now (like 10+ years), so, i don't expect to hear anything from it, but my parents are worried i'll get df.
lets see what happens.
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StephaneLaliberte
I am well past caring what those miserable people think
I wish I could say the same. My parents are still part of it, and I don’t want them to have to deal with the fallout of me being disfellowshipped. But after 10 years, I think I’ve been patient enough. By their own standards, they’re not supposed to bother me about it anymore.
That said, it really depends on the local congregation and its members. For example, the elders might not care. But it only takes one nosy sister to make me the focus of her conversations with everyone she meets. And just like that—VOILA!—the elders feel compelled to take action.
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I've done it: Christmas Lights Outside
by StephaneLaliberte inlets see if that causes a problem.
i've been inactive for a very long time now (like 10+ years), so, i don't expect to hear anything from it, but my parents are worried i'll get df.
lets see what happens.
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StephaneLaliberte
Lets see if that causes a problem. I've been inactive for a very long time now (like 10+ years), so, I don't expect to hear anything from it, but my parents are worried I'll get DF. Lets see what happens.
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I need to vent sorry!
by KerryKing ini couldn't get back to sleep last night, something my father said a few weeks ago popped into my head.. we were talking about obtaining citizenship, he doesn't need it, but was contemplating what benefits it could get him now he's a pensioner.. background : i've been disfellowhipped for 15 years, i was born in, he is an elder, very much pimi, he was also born in.. i said to him how citizenship would be difficult for him as it would require him to swear allegiance to the state?.
oh he said, thats just a crowd of people together in a big room for the swearing in event, it would be easy to just mumble or say nothing, nobody would know.. this has quietly been eating away in my mind, why did it bother me?.
last night it hit me, when i was in my first year of school, age 5, i came out of school one day with a balloon with two little pencils attached, a gift from a classmate who's birthday it was, every child got one.
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StephaneLaliberte
Like the people that went to jail for refusing any military or civil service and then all of a sudden it is okay to do non-combat military service,
I remember meeting one of these brothers. I recall that he was a ministerial servant and pioneer. I couldn’t help but wonder how he felt about that change. What made it worse was the fact that this change was introduced as a minor adjustment, and they never apologized for it. Meanwhile, some brothers went to jail for 1 or 2 years, for nothing!
That was one of those little things in my long list of grievances which ultimately led me out of the JWs.