Posts by ABibleStudent

36

What are the best questions?

by MissyM in

jw
friends

what would you say are the best questions to ask a jw which they will not be able to answer and may make them question their beliefs?.

what (if you are a former jw) made you question the "truth"?.

It depends on what are the consequences to the person asking the question(s) as well as the emotional state of the person being asked the question(s). Previous posters have written good questions for the authentic persona of a JW to question WTBTS doctrine issues, but what question(s) will help a JW's authentic persona to overcome their cult persona? IMHO if one cannot peak a JW's curiousity and help their authentic persona to overcome their cult persona, seeds of doubt will not grow very quickly.

It is easy to determine when a question has stumped a JW because a JW will not be able to respond for minutes, so don't say another word until a JW says something.

I like simple questions that target a JW's authentic persona, like when a JW asks when are you coming back to the KH, ask "How are you feeling? (pause to learn if a JW wants to talk about how they feel) Why are you still a JW (with an empathetic and concerned look)?" Once a JW's authentic persona is in control, then start asking one or possible two questions something like "I was stumped by something that someone asked me. Will you help me?" and then ask the seed of doubt question(s).

Also, I like to learn how to respond to JWs when JWs use thought stopping platitudes. The nice thing about the WTBTS is that it teaches thought-stopping platitudes that one can learn how to overcome and then stump JWs when they use those thought-stopping platitudes. A good zinger may be able to pierce a JW's cult persona, because the JW is confident that they have the perfect protection. I hope that more people will share those good zingers for the thought-stopping platitudes, like in the thread Conversation-stopper STOPPERS needed!.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

28

Going Back for the Right Reasons

by startingover13 in

jw
friends

i'm new to this site, but i have been following the topics for some time.

initially, it was during a deep search into the history of jehovah's witnesses, and yes, "apostate" sites.

i was born into the organization in 1989. my father was always more inclined to the organization than my mother, and soon after she was df'ed.

ABibleStudent

Welcome startingover13, Do you know that one of your fundamental beliefs that God's name is Jehovah is a falsehood? If you independently research the name Jehovah, you will learn that it is not God's name and that Rutherford thought it was a catchy brand to call Biblestudents Jehovah's Witnesses instead of Biblestudents to differenciate WTBTS Biblestudents from the BibleStudents who left the WTBTS from 1916 to 1930.

Best of wishes in critically thinking for yourself and having a happy marriage with your GF.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

9

How many inactive/DF JWs do You think know TTATT?

by BU2B in

jw
friends

so many have faded away for various reasons, or get df and stop attending meetings and go on with their lives.

i wonder how many of them have researched that the org may not be the truth, and how many go on believing it, but just mve on with their lives because they feel they are inadequate, cant live up to the standards, etc and feel they will be destroyed in armadeddon.

they physically free themselves but mentally are slaves.

ABibleStudent

Maybe less than 50% of ex-JWs know TTATT. The WTBTS's BITE control is very powerful and is the gift that keeps on giving to the WTBTS. I know a former pioneer, who left about 20 years ago and does not believe that the Bible is the word of God. He still believes that the WTBTS has the most correct interpretations of the Bible. Also, there are many JW apologists that comment on negative WTBTS comments. Some of those JW apologists left the WTBTS years ago and no longer believe in God.

IMHO it is a tragedy that ex-JWs are still victimized by WTBTS's BITE control.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

13

Jehovahs Witness elder arrested for sexual abuse

by truthseekeriam in

jehovahs witness elder arrested for sexual abuseposted on december 10, 2013 by wtleave a commenta man serving as a jehovahs witness elder minister in oklahoma was arrested on 19 counts of sexual abuse, according to authorities.

authorities said they had received numerous reports of other children being molested by ronald lawrence, 76 years of age, from more than 30 years ago.. it is believed, according to lawrences arrest warrant, the kingdom hall church where lawrence was an elder, chose not to inform law enforcement of the abuse.

authorities said that if the jehovahs witness church withheld information from authorities that they too could face criminal charges.. .

ABibleStudent

It is very sad children were abused/molested by one man and than abused again into keeping quiet by parents, elders, and/or the WTBTS.

Luke 6:41“Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye?

Even if it wasn't written in the Bible, IMHO it makes more sense to always evaluate ones actions and actions of organizations that one belongs to rather than find faults in others.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

29

Conversation-stopper STOPPERS needed!

by DS211 in

i have to get active.

my wife told me we have hospitality this weekend and i know the jw slingshot mechanism will engage after attendance.

so i have to get ready.

ABibleStudent

Hi DS211, The easiest way to counter WTBTS taught platitudes is to ask short and simple questions like what Phizzy suggested that guide your wife to confront her cognitive dissonance in small steps. Too much cognitive dissonance at once could cause your wife's cult persona to terminate all conversations. Before you use zingers to stop your wife from using thought stopping platitudes, you also need to learn how to bring out your wife's authentic persona. Your wife's authentic persona is your greatist ally against your wife's cult persona.

Whenever you ask your wife a question, don't say a word until she says something even if you have to wait for minutes. Remember every time you cause your wife to hesitate answering your questions. Those are the questions that cause your wife a lot of cognitive dissonance. My suggestions for the following platitudes would be:

"Wait on Jehovah" - How long have JWs been waiting? When did the WTBTS start predicting that Armageddon was going to happen soon? How long are you willing to wait for Armageddon to wait? Until you are 60? 70? 80? Can we start to plan for our retirement now?
"I will research that" - When will you start your research? What will you use to do your research? Will you be emulating the Bereans and independently researching what the WTBTS writes? If you do independent research, would the WTBTS/elders compliment you like the Bible does in Acts 17:11 when the Bereans read the Scriptures to verify what Paul said?
"I don't want to talk about it now!" - When will you want to talk about it? How would you feel if I told you that I don't want to talk about it, when you want to talk about something that is important to you? Would you like to watch the Matrix, Obilivion, or 1984 now?
"Where else would we go?" - How about follow the teachings of Jesus Christ like Simon Peter responded to Jesus Christ in John 6:60-70? Do you want to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ or follow the teachings of the WTBTS? Why didn't Jesus Christ order his twelve disciples to shun those disciples that left him in the desert in John 6:60-70? When (and why) did Jesus Christ order his disciples to shun or not to associate with other people?

Best of wishes helping your wife to think for herself.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

16

Need help to do a "talk"!

by ILoveTTATT in

jw
friends

the talk is called "the right religion demonstrates true faith in christ".

i have to help my fading gf give the talk.

if you have any subtle "apostate" ideas, i would appreciate them.. here is what i would like to say:.

ABibleStudent

Hi ILoveTTATT, I find the title of the talk "The right religion demonstrates true faith in Christ" to be a little self-serving for religions. Is it possible to show how Jesus Christ viewed Jewish religious leaders as hypocrites because of the burdens that were placed on the Jews without condemning the WTBTS. And, then finishing with members of the right religion would demonstrate true faith in Christ if they could respond to Jesus Christ like Simon Peter did in John 6:68-69.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

47

New here and having ah ha moments!

by Angus Beef in

jw
friends

what made you realize it was time to go?

i've been having health problems for the last few years and instead of any help, i'm listed as spiritually weak and of course associations is only my kids and husband.

all the good jw's have moved to other congregations and are doing well.

ABibleStudent

Welcome Angus Beef , You have a lot of options that do not involve leaving the WTBTS now. Make a plan about how you want to help yourself, your husband, your children, and your grandchildren.

Your plan should include that you independently research the WTBTS to discover whether your suspicions are factual, learning as much as possible about Steve Hassan's BITE control model and how it can help you to critically think for yourself, how to help your family to critically think for themselves, how to plan fun activities with your family members to help them meet more non-JWs who they share common interests, how to do more effective financial planning than waiting on the WTBTS's Jehovah, and venting your feelings and asking for advise on JWN to help you and your family.

The greatist gift that you can give to JWs is to help them to critically think for themselves instead of allowing the WTBTS to use BITE control techniques to victimized JWs.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

36

Quite an interesting first meeting with my Therapist.

by truthseekeriam in

jw
friends

the moment i mentioned jehovah's witnesses he headed over to his file cabinet and handed me this print out.. .

dear beloved one, .

i see your loneliness and fears.

ABibleStudent

Hi truthseekeriam, I agree with other posters that your description of your 1st visit with a therapist would raise red flags with me. I consider skepticism is a good thing, because it helps me to overcome my desire to trust people before they prove themselves as being trustworthy. If you have a plan about what you want to accomplish from your visits with a therapist, I feel that you will achieve greater success from your visits based on my personal experience.

I have visited 4 councilors in my life for two life changing events. I always think about what I want to accomplish when I visit a therapist to determine how long I will visit a therapist. What I want to accomplish changes with what is going on in my life.

When I got divorced, I visited three councilors before I stayed with one. One councilor I thought was very good and was religious. He was not covered by my insurance, so I decided to see more councilors who might be covered by my insurance. The second councilor was very, very empathetic, but I did not want empathy. I wanted to learn why I wanted to be with my ex-wife when we had an emotionally abusive and toxic relationship. I stayed with the third councilor until the insurance coverage ran out to vent my feelings instead of to my friends and coworkers. While seeing the third councelor, luckily a coworker recommended that I read a book, which had excercises that helped my to disover what childhood baggage I had that was trapping me emotionally to want to be with my ex-wife.

The second event was to understand my emotional conflicts in asking a woman to marry me. I saw one councelor who was covered by my insurance and she did help me to understand what was missing from my relationship and how to attain what I wanted with my girlfriend. Before I could talk to my girlfriend about working towards getting married she decided to terminate our relationship. Since I had already resolved my childhood baggage, I did not go through a lot of emotional turmoil.

Best of wishes to you and your husband on resolving your issues with your therapist.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

6

Lack of Zeal

by Kool Jo in

jw
friends

hey folks...was talking to an friend on skype who's a jw.

she mentioned that she no longer has the zeal to do fs and meetings ect...if a jw confided in you, how would you handle it without rasing suspisions whilst at the same same trying to get them to think or even plant a few seeds?.

she says once she leaves the kh, she doesn't feel the desire to do anything spiritual and that her fs time has reduced...she also told me that she feels "lazy" in her worship to jehovah.. thanks.

ABibleStudent

Hi Kool Jo, Just tell her that you care about her and how she feels. Ask her simple questions about how she feels and what does she feel is the cause of her lack of zeal. Listen to her for awhile and then suggest that she talk with a psychologist to help her because you are concerned about her becoming more depressed.

It could help her more if you suggested several psychologists including a couple of cult-exit counselors.

The most you can do without setting off her apostate alarms is to let her talk, empathize with her about her feelings and saying that her feelings are valid without saying that she should doubt the WTBTS, and suggesting that she gets emotional help before she feels worse. Jehovah gave her a brain, so Jehovah may be waiting on her to use it.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

18

How would you respond?

by MsGrowingGirl20 in

ok so this is a conversation that i am having with a friend that i really love.

i have some points that i want to say but tell me, how would you respond to this email?.

not gonna try to defend anyone i can really only speak for myself.

ABibleStudent

Hi MsGrowingGirl20, What do you want to accomplish with your email? Is your friend being shunned or is she shunning you?

I do feel that your paragraphs are too long and difficult to read.

It might help to just write that you love your friend and that you miss talking with her like you use to. If your friend is shunning you, would it hurt to write her saying that you do not want to force your beliefs on her and that life is too short to talk about the WTBTS with her.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert