Thank you Ablebodiedman, for citing that old WT article. I cant wait to use it on my MIL who is such a clueless JW that she didn't believe me when I told her the baptismal vows were changed in the 80's. I told her that "you and I didn't dedicate ourselves to an organization when we were baptized but rather to Jehovah and his son. Right? She agreed. I said when ******* (my daughter)got baptized, the society had changed to include their ORGANIZATION!. She didn't believe me and furthur insulted me by saying "I'd have to see THAT in writing." Can someone tell where the NU(80's) baptism vows are printed??? Thanks!
Posts by 3rdgen
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55"You knew what the consequences were when YOU decided to leave The Truth. This is YOUR decision and the outcome is YOUR responsibility."
by nicolaou inhow many of us have had to deal with a version of that retort?!
it's hurtful and i suspect - for some - that's partly because of the nagging feeling that our families may have a point.. but do they?.
i was 15 when i got baptised, is it reasonable that as the 50 year old man i'll be on my next birthday i continue to be held to a decision i made as a schoolboy?.
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Where in the Bible does it talk about an earthly Paradise as the JW's teach, and why only the JW's will be there?
by slam in -
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3rdgen
Many years ago Jws made a joke about explaining this doctrine in one visit with a householder. We called it the "From Adam to Armageddon sermon". The explanation ,in a nutshell was: The first human pair lived in Paradise with the prospect of living forever. They disobeyed Gods test of faith, they were ousted from the garden and died. God then decided to send Jesus to the earth to tell the good news that his death as a perfect man would pay the price for Adamic sin. This makes it possible for believers to be restored to gods favor and live in paradise as was gods origional purpose for the earth. Psalm 37:10,11 29 are read. Where at least the NWT says forever on earth. The wicked will be destroyed (at Armageddon Rev 16:16) so that paradise won't be messed up by mean people. At this point wicked is up to the mind of the listener. Of course, eventually they are taught the definition of wicked is ANYONE who doesn't get in the symbolic "Ark of Salvation" (parallel to Noah's day yada yada) which they identify as Gods visible organization to wit: Jehovah's Witnesses.so......There is a lot of assuming done in this explanation but it sounds good and at one time or another most of us bought it.
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"You knew what the consequences were when YOU decided to leave The Truth. This is YOUR decision and the outcome is YOUR responsibility."
by nicolaou inhow many of us have had to deal with a version of that retort?!
it's hurtful and i suspect - for some - that's partly because of the nagging feeling that our families may have a point.. but do they?.
i was 15 when i got baptised, is it reasonable that as the 50 year old man i'll be on my next birthday i continue to be held to a decision i made as a schoolboy?.
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3rdgen
Contracts signed under duress are invalid. My parents had DISOWNED my much older brother for simply choosing NOT to be baptized in the first place. By disowned I mean NO contact whatsoever and written out of the will. I didn't MEET him till I was 16. I knew if I didn't believe as they did I'd be homeless. I got dunked at 12. ALL of us entered into a fraudulent agreement and some of us entered that fraudulent agreement under duress. How valid can it be?
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How I see it in JW land
by tornapart inthey're tired... sooooo soooo tired.
they know it's all wrong but they keep telling themselves how wonderful it is.
almost as if they are trying to convince themselves.
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3rdgen
Another thought regarding whether or not Jw's are fizzling out. As I see it, zeal and joy are declining as a whole. Still the fear of loosing family,friends and business relationships keeps people attached to old habits. One of which is the habit of not thinking deeply or doing research on what is being taught. Another habit is attending assemblies and conventions. These pep rallies keep members satisfied that they have stayed in the right club. After all, it IS called the truth. At this point there are enough club members (no matter how unmotivated or unhappy) to keep it going by simply reproducing. When is the last time council has been given NOT to have children? Answer: not for decades. The WBT$ simply INSISTS they marry other baptized JWs. If plenty of children come from these unions, even if more leave than stay, even if the old die off, and even if there are no converts from the field there are enough to keep the club going for many many more "overlapping generations."
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How I see it in JW land
by tornapart inthey're tired... sooooo soooo tired.
they know it's all wrong but they keep telling themselves how wonderful it is.
almost as if they are trying to convince themselves.
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3rdgen
I ran into a sister not long ago who said "most of us are the walking dead". I ran into another sister who LOOKED like death walking who is taking care of 2 elderly parents while working part time, and attending a ASL language cong.(not deaf but the need was great, supposedly) I said," G***, these old ladies will kill you if you let them" She replied, "it's too late" and shuffled off. I really feel bad for her and the others who are stuck. OTOH, I have recently run into another family who's husband has become reactivated after 15 years out. They are all aggog about the troof these days. These JWs have 6 children. Two of them married brothers from a family of 6 children. There are a bazillion grandchildren. They are ALL Jdumbs. The org will live on more as a club than anything else,
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Thanks again, Simon, and difference between IE and Google Chrome
by compound complex inthere are some threads already on forum performance.
nonetheless, i wanted to post this:.
i decided to switch to my ie page and open up jwn there.
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3rdgen
I'm in the same spaghetti pot as you, Lois.
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3rdgen
Sammy so sorry. I know all to well the pain of being cheated on. When I found out I became sick. Literally. We're here to listen.
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What can I do??
by Nenmco infirst, i am married, but the marriage ended 11 years ago.
no sex, no emotion, just roommates paying the bills.
i met a wonderful jw gal about a year ago and we have been friends.
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3rdgen
It is unfair to your wife, kids? and yourself to start a relationship before you have exhausted every possibliity of reconciliation with your wife. Ie: counciling etc. If it's obvious you are beating a dead horse, by all means divorce. Only then will you be in any position to pursue someone else. Remember: It is just as easy to love a non- believer as a JW. Why are you asking for grief?
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I bet you can't sit still while listening to this
by Hortensia inhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoatqo82k-k.
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3rdgen
Wasblind, LOL You are 99.99% right about those that didn't dance to that music were dead. E X C E P T my husband. He is without a doubt devoid of all rhythm. He told me hilarious stories where back in the day he was in a mostly black cong. The sisters spent hours trying to teach him to dance (God love em) But even they eventually gave up!
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Millions now living will never die... *could* still be true...
by ILoveTTATT inplaying devil's advocate here...
researching online, i found that approximately 1% of the world's population is 90 years of age or older.
this means that, come 2015, there will still be around 70 million people who fit the bill of "now living" in 1925 and still living.
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3rdgen
My grandmother and father were among the "millions" who were believers at the time of Rutherfords prophecy. They are long dead. In fact, grandma died BEFORE I was born. Those people alive at that time are mostly all dead. period