Posts by Frank75

(Jeremiah 9:4-5) 4 "Guard yourselves each one against his own companion, and put YOUR trust in no brother at all. For even every brother would positively supplant, and every companion himself would walk around as a mere slanderer, 5 and they keep trifling each one with his companion; . . .

(Psalm 118:9) 9 It is better to take refuge in Jehovah Than to trust in nobles.

Clearly the bible contrasts the trust of God with not trusting in men, even those we would call brother. Although there may have been limited benefit of those words to apply to Israelite leaders who trusted in alliances with other nations and leaders, the context and language shows that the primary beneficiary of that warning was to the common Israelite.

Even though those leaders were "appointed" even "anointed" by God directly at times, the people were NOT to trust them blindly.

***
w033/1p.17TrustinJehovahWithAllYourHeart***
What
DoesItMeantoTrustinJehovah?

17
In addition, trusting in Jehovah means trusting those whom he trusts. For example, Jehovah has arranged for "the faithful and discreet slave" to care for the earthly Kingdom interests. (Matthew 24:45-47) We do not try to go it alone, and we do not ignore that appointment, for we trust in Jehovah’s arrangement. Further, elders serve in the local Christian congregation and, according to the apostle Paul, are appointed by holy spirit. (Acts 20:28) By cooperating with the elder arrangement in the congregation, we also show that we trust in Jehovah.—Hebrews 13:17.

I do not attempt to equate JW's with Israel as there is at least "bible" proof that God appointed those leaders and no evidence at all that JW's have any special status today. The above merely illustrates the disparity that exists between what the bible says and the WT teaches IT's followers!

Frank75

116

The Scotsman...this thread is started for you if you wish to comment....

by FreedomFrog in

jw
friends

the scotsman said:.

<< tee hee - dubs will believe anything, lol.>>.

that's good because you shouldn't believe everything you hear in this world.

Frank75

Seems to me that the Bible promotes faith in Jehovah and Jesus, NOT any group of men. Faith is built up and strengthened by questioning, by exploring the truthfulness of claims made, NOT by blind or unquestioning acceptance.

Good point H4C

The WT actually promotes faith in the infrastructure of the JW religion. When i had an issue years ago that i brought to the Service desk, the anonymous instruction I was given (even though i recognised his voice he would not confirm or deny who he was to me) was, "we need to have faith in the organization."

That is doctrinal, and perhaps Ninja can post the original article pasted here from the CD rom:

***
w793/1p.12FaithinJehovah’sVictoriousOrganization***
a small congregation of sincere Bible students divorced themselves from all of Christendom’s religious organizations. They turned their backs on its sectarian creeds and followed the example of the first-century Beroeans who searched the Scriptures daily to arrive at the apostolic faith. ...

The aforesaid congregation earnestly sought to prove worthyof being Jehovah’s visible organizationand his instrument.

The WT does not say that the bible students were part of Jehovah's organization, but "are" that visible organization. The article asks the reader to have faith in "it".

That is idolatry and you are perhaps too blind at present to yet recognize it for what it is.

Frank75

116

The Scotsman...this thread is started for you if you wish to comment....

by FreedomFrog in

jw
friends

the scotsman said:.

<< tee hee - dubs will believe anything, lol.>>.

that's good because you shouldn't believe everything you hear in this world.

Frank75

Correction - gossip is a way of life IN LIFE. So because some gossiped thats it - the entire organisation 6.7 million are just rejected.

Now that is an over simplification. No one here left the WT religion because of Gossip alone. You made a point of waving the morality of JW's. The poster was merely pointing out it is not a commendable record at all!

"Gossip as a way of life"? Not really for those who are progressing in "The Christ" and making over their minds and putting on the new personality. Sure people will gossip as it is a sign of immaturity, and most gossip is harmless banter about people with no malice. However in the WT world, the elders and their wives are renowned for their malicious gossip that slanders peoples good reputation. The pioneers, elders, MS's, CO, DO and Bethel leaders all thrive on gossip and make life altering decisions and judgments based on such hearsay and gossip.

Again if you were allowed access to the congregation files you would see just how vicious, petty, vindictive and slanderous letters of introduction are. The ones authoring these letters are not newbies but represent the very core culture of the WT religion. That only deals with written slanders or libel, then there is the whispering and verbal attacks that murder people socially and worse.

Then there is the snitching that goes on, often times without much basis or just one eye witness. Jesus said, " if your brother commits a sin, go lay bare his fault between you and him alone".

This is never followed by the adherents of the WT religion. Likewise, the WT has negated these words of Christ by saying, "Jesus meant theft or slander sin here, gross sin must go straight to the elders!"

What is the justification scripturally for that interpretation? Jesus said SIN, end of story and with no qualification.

But even with the JW perversion of this text, Dubs do not try to deal with such problems alone, but rather choose to badmouth and slander their brothers and TRY them in the court of public opinion. By the time the elders stick their noses in, there is no one unbiased enough to render any help!

Read the story of Joseph when he learned Mary was pregnant and how he planned to deal with the matter. Ask yourself if that course he took (the narrative labels him righteous for doing so) is encouraged by the WT religion or leaders. I would be curious to know your answer!

As far as rejecting 6.7 million, I don't think any of us have done that, but rather they have been forced by the WT to reject us. You are an exception and we are happy that you are here even though you would be severely punished if your elders and friends knew you were here talking to us.

I once felt as you do Obiwan Scotsman, but you will soon see that there is very little redemptive value in the WT religion.

Paul said, " having a form of godly devotion but proving false to its power; and from these turn away. 6 For from these arise those men who slyly work their way into households and lead as their captives weak women loaded down with sins, led by various desires, 7 always learning and yet never able to come to an accurate knowledge of truth.

The WT leaders are sly my brother. They have all of you on a tread mill to keep you "learning" but never seeing the truth! Look closely at those words and you will see why most of us left the Watchtower religion. Obedience to that counsel and honest recognition of who it applies to!

Frank75

116

The Scotsman...this thread is started for you if you wish to comment....

by FreedomFrog in

jw
friends

the scotsman said:.

<< tee hee - dubs will believe anything, lol.>>.

that's good because you shouldn't believe everything you hear in this world.

Frank75

but please have the sense and courtesy to acknowledge the good aspects of us.

Scotsman:

You are actually the one being discourteous. Discourteous to all those who are victims of abuse which includes sexual abuse inside the WT religion. To all those who have been hit on by elders and MS's, witnessed wife swapping, sex parties and scores of young couples forced into loveless marriages because of doing what is natural. Their stories are here and all over the Internet. Many have never even told their story. Like my wife's cousin who was molested by their PO from age 4 to 14. He also molested her sister and two brothers. Then there is the discouraged elder i met in the DR who had been sent a bad letter of introduction. His only lament was "how could those other elders do that to him when he had helped two of them hide their affairs from the congregations"

The dubs are no better than anyone else in the area of morals, and arguably worse because they are repressed. When it comes to financial matters the WT "no sue" policy makes the congregations a den of thieves!

JW's propagate the appearance of piety and moral uprightness, however beneath the surface there is just like the Jews of Jesus day, a pile of dead man's bones. You are obviously not an elder and even then not all elders involve themselves in the JC process.

When you have the chance to rifle through just one congregations JC files then come back here and tell us we are wrong!

Frank75

23

Preaching Work is unique identifier

by besty in

several conversations with current jw's have thrown up this validation of their faith.

i can think of several lines of refutation: .

1 - ask 'is increase proof of gods blessing?

Frank75

Nothing really works for the truly committed and brain dead dub, however if you have someone with doubts, these (beliefs such as "we are preaching the Good News!) are propagandist pegs that hold even the dissident dub in limbo.

I have used Gal 1:8 with success by asking the dub if "the preaching work, method and most importantly message is the same as 1st Century?"

If they say yes, then ask them to point out 1914 doctrine, paradise earth, great crowd or similar belief being preached. They then will say "No"!

Gal 1:8?

However, even if we or an angel out of heaven were to declare to YOU as good news something beyond what we declared to YOU as good news, let him be accursed.

I also like to read with them Matt 28:19, 20. After reading it i ask them if they have personally baptised anyone or would be permitted to.

So why is the "go therefore and preach" part binding on you and yet the "baptizing them" part is not? Who decides which of Jesus commands you do and which you do not?

Frank75

41

My Story

by Missanna in

ok for some reason i can't sleep tonight and feel like writing so i'm gonna tell my story of how i got to this point.

.

ahhhhm.

Frank75

It's not because you are 19 and gorgeous (if that is your real age and picture). It is because you are 19 and have already figured out what it took me 25 fricken more years than you to figure out. And you have already found the courage to post your "truth" for the world to see on the internet. Kudos to you. You do not have to spend the next 25 years of your life feeling like shit and trying to make yourself feel better by being "better". I am in awe of you.

I could not put it better myself. Good for you Missana!

Love, peace and best of luck!

Frank75

19

Most X-JW's turn to paganism

by White Dove in

that's what a witch at a pagan shop told me.

Frank75

I'm a pagan because I have a Christmas tree every year......and send my JW a mothers day card........

As a JW I was a pagan because I wear a pagan wedding ring, and at my wedding ate cake and had other pagan traditions.

I agree with NVR that the only problem with pagans is we are part of the world around us.

I also agree with the post above that all religion is bad. The evidence of that truth more than speaks for itself.

Frank75

56

Bad biblical names for a child

by erandir in

jw
friends

the practice of choosing biblical names for children is present in many forms of christianity.

in latin america, countless boys are named jesus either as a first name or second name.

there is even that singer jesus jones.

Frank75

I was amazed in Spanish, how many people named their kids Jesus! Pronounced "hey zeus"

We had one in our congregation in the DR. He was originally from Puerto Rico and spoke english. We had visitors from Canada once and he marches up and declares:

"Hi, I am Jesus"

LOL

Frank75

14

Why don't apologists talk to each other?

by Paralipomenon in

jw
friends

in the time i've been reading these forums i've seen a few apologists posting on threads, but what i've never seen was them interacting with each other.

is it the same person with multiple logins, or is there some sort of code of honor that prevents them from agreeing with each other.

is it like seeing another witness in a porno store?

Frank75

Is it like seeing another witness in a porno store? They realize they aren't supposed to be there, but just ignore each other and hope nobody calls them on it?

Curious minds want to know.

LMAO!!

You guys are hilarious!

When i saw the thread, this is exactly what popped into my mind!

It is so true, they are guilty deep down because they know they aren't supposed to be here, but if it wasn't for this place they would likely be inactive!

Frank75