NAME JUST ONE thing....ONE THING...revealed by God....

by Terry 284 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  belbab

  Name just one thing written in the Bible that was completely UNknown by humans which only a superhuman agency could have revealed. One thing.

  Terry and all who posted in this thread,

  
  I have read all twelve pages.

  Is the above statement an order, a challenge or a request? I will consider it as a request and make a reply as brief as possible.

  Revelation 13:10
  He who leads into captivity shall go into captivity; he who kills with the sword must be killed with thesword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints. New King James Version © 1982 Thomas Nelson

  These words were written by a man in prison, who writes that he received these words not from humans, but from a “super human agency” who revealed them to him.

  The revealer of these words had previously said: (verse 52)

  And suddenly, one of those who were with Jesus stretched out his hand and drew his sword, struck the servant of the high priest, and cut off his ear. New King James Version © 1982 Thomas Nelson

  But Jesus said to him, "Put your sword in its place, for all who take the sword will perish by the sword. New King James Version © 1982 Thomas Nelson Matt 26:51, 52

  Note that Jesus did not say all those who carry a sword would perish by the sword, for he said put your sword in its place. He had previously asked whether anyone had a sword, (for instruction purposes?).

  So, my request to you all is:

  Name one tyrant, individual or collective, throughout recorded history, who takes up the figurative sword and relies on killing instruments of war and who has not perished and his works became undone.

  Whole nations have and are now mobilized for war. The significance of the above revelation is unknown to them. They believe that they will succeed by warfare. Recorded history shows they are wrong.

  belbab
• 

  ringo5

  So, my request to you all is:

  Name one tyrant, individual or collective, throughout recorded history, who takes up the figurative sword and relies on killing instruments of war and who has not perished and his works became undone.

  Whole nations have and are now mobilized for war. The significance of the above revelation is unknown to them. They believe that they will succeed by warfare. Recorded history shows they are wrong.

  belbab

  I think your question is more insightful as it pertains to the human condition, as opposed to the divine nature of the quote "those who live by the sword die by the sword".

  It is interesting, as you pointed out, that he recalled those words while in prison, no doubt guarded by swords or the like.

  Because if your position requires you believe this is part of inspired scripture, I have to say, whoever inspired the whole of scripture ( I'm assuming here you believe the inspiration of the bible), has given a somewhat mixed message.

  Or, perhaps he hasn't clarified that statement enough, because it seems whenever swords, warfare or violence in general is mentioned in the bible, it's moral justification is always dependant on if it's sanctioned by God or not. (rev 6:8, james 2:21, and many others plus all of the old testament)

  This is to say nothing of his followers who have had this divinely inspired truism all this time, and yet for some reason have been at the forefront of sword-play and the like since.

  One has to wonder if the divine nature who inspired this book might better have considered his audience so as ensure his message was not so badly misunderstood.
• 

  Terry

  I have also encountered the love of God. These are allcompletelydifferent experiences, and the best by far is experiencing the embrace of God, hands down.

  The "love of God" is the best for a very good reason! You can take it or leave at will! It pops like a soap bubble when you aren't "in the mood" and no obligation to explain is necessary since you are the one conjuring it up in the first place.

  The "love of God" is alot like masturbating to a fantasy if you stop and think about it.

  You feel "the need" and you put your mind in the mode of idealizing a particular reverie and mood. You perform whatever ritual gets you off and then---"pop" it goes away and you get back to your daily business!

  God is a tool of feeling, importance, direction, authority---whatever you need it to be whenever you need it. Like a battery-operated vibrator in the night stand next to the bed. You only have to make sure the batteries are fresh! (Renew your faith).

  I completely understand what you are saying. Pity is that you don't.
• 

  Terry

  Name one tyrant, individual or collective, throughout recorded history, who takes up the figurative sword and relies on killing instruments of war and who has not perished and his works became undone.

  You are aware, of course, that time destroys everything anyway; right?

  The nature of things is that they erode, decay, change and vanish regardless of ideology, theology, race, religion or zip code.

  But, you know that---right?
• 

  nvrgnbk

  Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

  Entropy.
• 

  eclipse

  You feel "the need" and you put your mind in the mode of idealizing a particular reverie and mood. You perform whatever ritual gets you off and then---"pop" it goes away and you get back to your daily business!

  God is a tool of feeling, importance, direction, authority---whatever you need it to be whenever you need it. Like a battery-operated vibrator in the night stand next to the bed. You only have to make sure the batteries are fresh! (Renew your faith).

  ( I used to replace my batteries alotbecause my god feeling needed a tremendous amount of faith juice)
• 

  bebu

  I completely understand what you are saying. Pity is that you don't.

  No, you haven't understood a single thing I wrote! But I understand why not, and I'm not surprised. You can only compare this to the most likely of what you know.

  If I could re-create it, I would. I've never been able to "make" such an encounter happen, either the first or the last time (over 20 years ago, btw), ever. BUT they left me left realizing that a) God truly sees me and is with me forever, and b) God loves me passionately. These are my backbone. I spot sly reminders of them from time to time, but not as bare as before. There is no simple reason for them then, nor their absence since. All I know is, God took hold of me then and the impression has endured.

  bebu
• 

  Cold Creek Swimmer

  No , you haven't understood a single thing I wrote! But I understand why not, and I'm not surprised. You can only compare this to the most likely of what you know.

  If I could re-create it, I would. I've never been able to "make" such an encounter happen, either the first or the last time (over 20 years ago, btw), ever . BUT they left me left realizing that a) God truly sees me and is with me forever, and b) God loves me passionately. These are my backbone. I spot sly reminders of them from time to time, but not as bare as before. There is no simple reason for them then, nor their absence since. All I know is, God took hold of me then and the impression has endured.

  bebu

  Bebu,

  Please explain how this as anything to do with the topic and proving that the bible writers could only have received some of their info from God. The "feeling" of God's love in your life only proves that YOU are sure that there is a god. It provides absolutely no cold hard facts that anyone else can look at and say "Hey, you have a good point. I'll reconsider my position." I believe that this is what Terry is looking for. A reason to believe beyond the idea of faith in the invisible and unseen "presence" that most call "GOD".

  Reverse engineering with the idea that "this and that are so complex only a god could have created them" does not prove anything. Take, for example, a bucket of toothpicks. Lift the bucket in the air and turn it upside down. Make a note of their exact location. Put all 1000 toothpicks back in the bucket. Repeat process. Tell me how long until the first drop is duplicated. The "complex" order that they fell into, does not speak of a creator. It can only be described in those terms if you reverse engineer the order that they landed. "The locations of these tooth picks are so complex that someone must have placed them like this. This could never have happened randomly. I could do this for a thousand years and never come up with this result."

  Get my drift? The odds that during conception all of the necessary genes and enzymes and cells came together to make up your body specifically are astronomically against it ever happening-but it did. Again, please give a logical item that proves these bible writers could not have known that about which they wrote. A feeling of love does not count, as it is an emotion that varies from person to person.

  CCS
• 

  fedorE

  BUT IT SERVES A PURPOSE

  The Bible, Religion, faith, serves the purpose to lessen the pain of loss. Whoever thought of introducing the Bible to Mankind was doing us a favor because even if they couldnt see past its contradictions and harm IT nevertheless provided an avenue for survivors of those lost in death to deal with the pain through the fantasy of seeing their loved one in heaven.( Dealing with bad ppl ..well their now in Hell.) In the JWs ...theyll be rewarded with a resurection. It seems Mankind will come to its senses and acknowledge, with baby steps, our own revelations. Those in the Bible, the Koran, ect.... will come to be viewed as myths much like Peter Pan. But for now it serves a Purpose.
• 

  bebu

  CCS, re-read my first post and my questions about parameters, and thus my response. I also point out that I am NOT the only one who has experienced such a thing. Revelation means that someone--a particular person or group--has had something revealed. I am a specific someone. There are other people whose unique experiences corroborate with mine on a basic level.

  Part of the problem is the expectation that God must behave only within the limits of science or reason (or theology), and answer the question to fit into the atheist's framework. If there is a God, we simply can't dictate anything, though I generally enjoy frameworks. We are stuck with trying to see what is the purpose or advantage is for His unorthodox methods.

  Turn the telescope around.

  Students could simply wish to be spoon-fed knowledge, for example; but a better teacher would provoke his students to wrestling with questions in order to become true learners. The method may make some students angry that they are not getting straight answers, but what a difference for those who accept the challenge. JWs are trained to be spoon-fed. JWD makes people into questioners--and so these threads like Terry's are good. An answer like mine seems like a cowlick, but it is an answer.

  BTW, AS gives a very interesting argument of a whole different kind (of cowlick).

  bebu