Climate Change The New Catalyst For Globalists/Communist Utopia

by Perry 372 Replies latest members politics

  • besty
    besty
    lcome, I've made some friends here, sometimes I'm entertained. That's it. But since you can't think outside of "scientific consensus" I don't expect you to get itps. I used to see your global warming posts as blah blah blah blah blah blah, but I must be getting older. I put on my reading glasses and see that it really says Baaa baaa Baaa baaa Baaa baaa Baaa baaa Baaa baaah SO go ahead an needle away about me bumping your thread. It's your way of deflecting. Good job son.

    You don't really have 7,500 posts Priest. You have 7.5 posts 1000 times over.

    Why don't you ignore climate change threads safe in the knowledge that you are right and we who prefer to engage in factual debate are wasting our time?

    Why can't you see that your useless graffiti is just annoying to at least one side of the debate, possibly both?

    I struggled to find anything in your entire contribution to this particular thread that even barely resembled a fact. Just a complete and utter lack of anything.

    Until Simon sees fit to implement an Ignore button....

  • B-Rock
    B-Rock

    How can the charts be trusted if the data is getting manpulated? How can we say "go to peer reviewed journals" if there is an effort to not publish research papers that go against the agenda?

    The problem extends past the East Anglia CRU, NOAA/GHCN "homogenization" falsified climate declines into increases:

    http://wattsupwiththat.com/2009/12/08/the-smoking-gun-at-darwin-zero/

    The Smoking Gun At Darwin Zero

    8 12 2009

    by Willis Eschenbach

    People keep saying “Yes, the Climategate scientists behaved badly. But that doesn’t mean the data is bad. That doesn’t mean the earth is not warming.”

    Let me start with the second objection first. The earth has generally been warming since the Little Ice Age, around 1650. There is general agreement that the earth has warmed since then. See e.g. Akasofu . Climategate doesn’t affect that.

    The second question, the integrity of the data, is different. People say “Yes, they destroyed emails, and hid from Freedom of information Acts, and messed with proxies, and fought to keep other scientists’ papers out of the journals … but that doesn’t affect the data, the data is still good.” Which sounds reasonable.

    There are three main global temperature datasets. One is at the CRU, Climate Research Unit of the University of East Anglia, where we’ve been trying to get access to the raw numbers. One is at NOAA/GHCN, the Global Historical Climate Network. The final one is at NASA/GISS, the Goddard Institute for Space Studies. The three groups take raw data, and they “homogenize” it to remove things like when a station was moved to a warmer location and there’s a 2C jump in the temperature. The three global temperature records are usually called CRU, GISS, and GHCN. Both GISS and CRU, however, get almost all of their raw data from GHCN. All three produce very similar global historical temperature records from the raw data.

    So I’m still on my multi-year quest to understand the climate data. You never know where this data chase will lead. This time, it has ended me up in Australia. I got to thinking about Professor Wibjorn Karlen’s statement about Australia that I quoted here:

    Another example is Australia. NASA [GHCN] only presents 3 stations covering the period 1897-1992. What kind of data is the IPCC Australia diagram based on?

    If any trend it is a slight cooling. However, if a shorter period (1949-2005) is used, the temperature has increased substantially. The Australians have many stations and have published more detailed maps of changes and trends.

    The folks at CRU told Wibjorn that he was just plain wrong. Here’s what they said is right, the record that Wibjorn was talking about, Fig. 9.12 in the UN IPCC Fourth Assessment Report, showing Northern Australia:

    Figure 1. Temperature trends and model results in Northern Au

  • besty
    besty
    got it wrong on time magazine......humble apologies.......

    Ninj - wouldn't it be just as easy to check the Time website in the 1st place rather than pasting a faked Photoshopped image from a conspiracy site?

    <assuming you didn't create the image yourself>

    The more serious issue is that people who don't bother with their own fact-checking see this kind of thing, draw erroneous conclusions and leave with a completely incorrect view on the matter. The damage is done well before you graciously post an apology after the fact - the casual reader or ideologist has moved on by then, or worse - uses your image second-hand to further promote that view, and so on.

  • Priest73
    Priest73

    Way to take the high road Paul. I hope you're proud.

  • besty
    besty

    B-Rock

    B-Rock My first question to you remains unanswered: Are you implying that the CIA stating there is scientific consensus is the same thing as there actually being scientific consensus? When you answer that I will respond suitably. Second question: Why have you chosen not to respond to my deconstruction of the Forbes/Washington Post half-truth misquotes? Third question: Why the instant ad hominem? You are industrial strength grade A certifiable, buddy.

    Fourth question:

    Why do you keep pasting more 'stuff' without answering my questions?

  • JWoods
    JWoods

    The great thing about opinions is that we all got 'em, and as JWoods opined earlier in the thread, not everybody in a labcoat is an expert.

    What I meant by this is that there is a huge amount of tautology on this subject. In another comment, continually a big deal is made about how 9x.x % of "peer reviewed" and "published" scientists support the most drastic results of and "cures" for Global Warming. Now that the Anglia data has been exposed - we can see that "peer reviewed" and "published" does not mean much of anything, except that people that get through that process are necessarily part of the scare tactic enthusiasts; the sceptical others have to come out on their own and are then maligned for it as being "fringe nuts". Not that they are unqualified (Henrik Svensmark is an example) - just that they are not members of the old "skull and bones" club.

    Think about it - how many actual global weather scientists are there? And HOW and WHY did they get into this field? I will submit that this is still only a handful of academics; and that they got into the inner circle by exactly the same peer accreditation that those English Emails reveal - they were pre-screened to be sure the new guys and gals were true believers.

    I am already disgusted by the video that the Copenhagen people put up to title the convention: A little girl is getting attacked by tornado, tsunami, high tide, etc. - and holding desperately onto the last standing dead tree for dear life.

    This kind of propaganda is the earmark of serious science? I submit that this is the earmark of a determined attempt at Zero-Sum Global Wealth Distribution thinly disguised as some kind of alchemic science.

  • JWoods
    JWoods

    I posted again because it looks like I was on the dreaded cusp of "page change."

    Page changeover disappearance is real, my friends.

  • bohm
    bohm

    JWoods: Like Henrik Svensmark? i can mention 3 sceptics i know of - how did they get into the small, closed, club?

    I agree there is a TON of bullshit on the pro-warming side, usually from politicians and journalists; i am not a great fan of Al Gores movie either. But i dont believe there is good reason to doubt the actual research as such, even though it is often being turned into propeganda and or is proposed 'solved' by solutions which are nonsense, eg. bio ethanol from eatible products.

  • besty
    besty
    In another comment, continually a big deal is made about how 9x.x % of "peer reviewed" and "published" scientists support the most drastic results of and "cures" for Global Warming.

    just to be clear:

    97.5% of actively publishing climatologists responded YES to the following question:

    "Do you think human activity is a significant contributing factor in changing mean global temperatures?"

    Source: Doran 2009 http://tigger.uic.edu/~pdoran/012009_Doran_final.pdf

    There is nothing in this quote about drastic results or 'cures' - simply a yes/no response to an observational question.

    Why is it so difficult to just stick with the unvarnished facts JWoods?

    If you could even be arsed to read the 2 page report I have linked twice now you would have answers to most of your questions on how many scientists are involved in climate research etc etc.

    But the facts don't suit the armchair conspiracy theorist - hence the never-ending innuendo and motive-questioniong directed at tens of thousands of scientists. Pathetic.

  • JWoods
    JWoods

    Is anybody else seeing the last page of this thread? My view is blank past the bottom of 14...

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