What hope is there then? (page 7)

leavingwt

If the bible is inspired, then it is all we need for guidence.

It's more simple than that, actually. The only question you need to answer is: Did Jesus Christ rise from the dead?

sir82

If it isn't inspired then what book is?

There you go again. Who says there must be one?

Who says God must communicate via a book?

Time to start thinking ouside the box.

notverylikely

Some folks prefer the comfort of a lie, rather than the truth.

"I love you, baby."

"I'll call you back."

"I'll tell you before I c..." ....uh, nevermind on that last one.

JWoods

I mentioned it before, but again now: Perhaps we are focusing too much on personal hope, and not enough on hope for the general future of humanity.

There is much historical reason to hope for the future life and welfare of mankind for many generations. We are actually far better off than our ancestors were (and demonstrably better off than people of biblical times).

PSacramento

It's more simple than that, actually. The only question you need to answer is:

Did Jesus Christ rise from the dead?

Yes.

How do I know?

Valid question, if he hadn't, there would have been ample time and it would have been easy to prove, he didn't.

No body was produced and many excuses were made, don't forget, his apostles DIED believing in what they saw ( the ressurected Jesus) if THEY have perpatrated a hoax, they wouldn't have died for it.

leavingwt

if THEY have perpatrated a hoax, they wouldn't have died for it.

Yeah, I used to buy that. Then, I had a look around the planet. People will die for a lot less.

sir82

his apostles DIED believing in what they saw ( the ressurected Jesus) if THEY have perpatrated a hoax, they wouldn't have died for it.

At the risk of taking this even farther off topic, plenty of people throughout the centuries have died for what they believed in - and what they believed in was a lie.

Sincerity to the point of martyrdom is no proof of the validity of one's belief. Just ask any potential Muslim suicide bomber.

PSacramento

Yeah, I used to buy that. Then, I had a look around the planet. People will die for a lot less.

How many of them died KNOWING it was a hoax?

The apostles, IF they created the hoax, would have KNOW it to be a hoax and a lie and NOT worth dying for.

That is the difference, it would be like Jim Jones drinking his OWN kool-aid.

leavingwt

PSac -- It's like being in a cult. NOBODY actually in the cult thinks it's a cult. So, those guys dying, they probably believed it. We don't have to introduce a hoax story in conjunction with this. I'm certainly not suggesting that there was a missing body hoax.

sir82

The apostles, IF they created the hoax, would have KNOW it to be a hoax and a lie and NOT worth dying for.

True, assuming (1) they were sane, and did not start believing their own lies (again thru the centuries, people have lied long enough, or become crazy enough, to believe their own lies)...and (2) the accounts we have of the apostles' death are accurate.

No matter how you slice, it comes down to credibility...or faith if you prefer.

What hope is there then?

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