Atheists..... throwing the baby out with the bath water ?

by snare&racket 403 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  bohm

  it is such a beautiful way of arguing:

  • everything has to have a cause
  • ..because thats just pure logic, cause and effect, forget all about quantum mechanics
  • ..well not "everything", the one thing i demonstrate to exist is except from the above rule. it does not need a cause.
  • any cause you can come up with need to have another cause
  • ..because everything has to have a cause..
  • ..except the one thing i want to demonstrate exist, that is the exception
  • the thing i want to demonstrate exist can cause anything, including this universe, by magic.
  • SO IT EXIST!
  • presto!
• 

  NewChapter

  You don't win the debate by default Witness. Just because the answers are unknown, it doesn't make you right. Make up the hypothesis and put it up for falsification. If you're onto something, I'm sure the scientific world would like to know.

  NC
• 

  whereami

  
• 

  whereami
• 

  fulltimestudent

  to Newchapter.

  I was not having a shot at you.

  It just so happened that I noted a certain similarity to the Gautama Buddha's experience as he sat under a Bodhi tree and experienced a sudden enlightenment/awakening/knowing. And, at that moment, I guess we can say that Buddhism came into existence to become the major spiritual and philosophical force in East Asia.

  I rather liked your experience.
• 

  NewChapter

  LOL!
• 

  NewChapter

  Hi Fulltime---I didn't see it as a shot. LOL Sorry if it sounded defensive. I was just trying to clarify some things. I love Buddhists. You know, even though I don't believe in god or spirits, I do recognize that the institution has the longest history of seeking truths about us. So they do have some insight into many areas. I love Buddhists. I don't take anything spiritual away, but just like the golden rule, all of their ideas are not bunk. It used to be the most intellegent people holed up in monastaries and thought about life. And they weren't always writing about gods, so they stumbled onto some pretty cool stuff.

  NC
• 

  Phizzy

  N.C Just read your post about becoming a non-believer in 30 seconds , somewhat similar to my experience, but I then embarked on a long journey to confirm I was not mistaken.

  N.C the born-again Atheist, now, that is a good label !
• 

  cofty

  The basic fallacy of atheism is that it is positing an absolute negative - which doesn't stand to reason. To say "I am absolutely positive that there is absolutely no creator of the universe - otherwise known as God" is a logical conundrum. And if this is not what you are saying or what you believe, then I wouldn't lump myself in with people like Sam Harris and Richard Dawkins and call myself an atheist. Because that is the definition of atheism.

  I have yet to meet a dictionary atheist. Do you think we are so stupid as not to know we can't prove a negative?

  Have you read any Harris or Dawkins? It would appear not. Dawkins has said in the God Delusion that on a scale of 1-7 he would rate himself as a 6 for the very reason you can't prove a negative.

  I am very familar with every argument that has been made for god and found them all thoroughly unconvincing. I am persuaded by a number of compelling arguments against god's existence.

  If you ever come up with something new then I will be delighted to consider it with an open mind. If it turns out you were right I will say "well what do you know I was wrong there is a god after all, woo hoo"

  I call myself an atheist, what you call me is up to you.
• 

  Giordano

  Some speculation, has this big bang happened before? Perhaps it's a natural expansion/contraction process fueled with dark energy and matter. Something like a tide played out over tens of billions of years. I think there is some sort of string theory involved in that speculation. But if it has happened before........ forget about 13.7 Billion years....we are looking at 10's of billions maybe trillions of years. I share the opinion that the universe has always existed in one form or another, though not always hospitable to life forms. Only 5% of everything we can see forms the universe. The remaining 95% is made up of dark matter and dark energy which we know very little about. Since little is known about dark matter and dark energy, and very little about black holes and a million other strange things in the universe speculating that a fifteenth century version of god created it all is somewhat silly. However being an expert at knowing when the train was about to leave the station ........"Pope Pius XII declared, at the November 22, 1951 opening meeting of the Pontifical Academy of Sciences, that the Big Bang theory accorded with the Catholic concept of creation. [ 89 ] Conservative ProtestantChristian denominations have also welcomed the Big Bang theory as supporting a historical interpretation of the doctrine of creation. [ 90 ]

  Since the acceptance of the Big Bang as the dominant physical cosmological paradigm, there have been a variety of reactions by religious groups as to its implications for their respective religious cosmologies. Some accept the scientific evidence at face value, while others seek to reconcile the Big Bang with their religious tenets, and others completely reject or ignore the evidence for the Big Bang theory." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang#Dark_energy

  There is much more to learn about our universe but one thing I am sure about, religions will not be contributing much to the discussion. They will ride their holy train into the future knowing that they will make every adjustment they must to stay in power.