Please worship our god or he will kill you! (page 13)

still thinking

Answering a question with a question isn't an answer...psac.

Ironic...since that is EXACTLY what you do when someone asks YOU a question.

May I suggest you actually look at what you have written so far... Nearly every response has been a question.

still thinking

I am sure you were trying to make a point, I just hope it wasn;t suggesting that I am homophobic or racists, was it?..psac

It would appear you missed the entire point, and then tried to change the issue to appear that you are being accused of something else.

This is a prime example of how some christians tell people they are superior then go into denial when they don't want to admit that this is what they really think. Non christians are 'broken', 'not fully human' etc...but no, christians aren't superior in any way.......if you cannot see that this is how prejudice begins I don't know what to say.

snare&racket

SPac....., you claim and at the same time show your ignorant hand to us all, that it is a JW notion to believe that the god of the bible would kill those that didnt worship him or submit to him etc...

If you decide to believe the scrolls from the desert, written by Jewish tribes thousands of years ago, (what on earth do they have to do with you at all?) then I assu e you will come across the story of the flood. The bible says that there were civilisations all over the world when the flood came.

Do you deny this account? Because the lineage of Jesus goes back to Adam via Noah. So its not something that can be cherry picked by the modern Christian who likes to put the Old Testament under a dark blanket where no one will discuss it,

So did your god once flood the world killing women, children, old men and women..... because they were marrying, eating, drinking and taking no note?

Would you condone that act if it was done by a human demanding exclusive devotion? Is it moral just because you believe a god did it? Is it moral because he made us and therefore has the right to do anything to our lives if we displease him?

Ask yourself if is is EVER moral to drown a child? Are you going to dare say ...... It is if MY god does it? What if Zeus does it? Or Allah? Do you think its moral still?, because they are gods?

You are better than the bible........... If you deny this, you haven't read it. 7 million people haven't read it. They have it read to them, but funny enough, its the same verses over and over, the nasty bits kinda get skipped..... READ YOUR BIBLE! Take a peek at who you are backing! Would you vote for the god of the bible if he had that history ? So why worship such a horrid charachter? If you want to believe he is real, FINE, go read your bible from page one and accept everything he does and says as real.... You will soon see that he isn't the warm, fatherly, bearded,, caring and loving god you imagine and you will quickly wonder who this god is .... Read your bible, see what it says this god thinks, says and does.... That's the only reason we are all the other side of the fence now, we read the bible..... Simple as that.

snare

PSacramento

PSac - its perfectly simple. You said that a christian is made fully human when they accept christ.

Logically it follows that they were previously not "fully human".

Please explain very simply how I can be not fully human, and yet not in any way inferior to a christian.

All I have seen so far is obfusaction.

Hi Cofty,

I said that a person is made fully human AS GOD INTENDED when they accept Christ, that process of becomeing fully human AS GOD INTENDED doesn't just happen with a "snap of the fingers' of course butI think the issue is what do I mean when I say "fully human as God intended".

To be fully human as God intended is to be One with God, much like Adam and Eve were before the fall, a other- centred relationship of love with God. God made us in His image and if God is a Triune God then God is a relational being, a being of "other-centred" love and if we are mad ein His image and made to abide in Him then we are only fully human as God intended when we do just that, Abide in Him.

It doesn't make those that do not abide in him any less human, it makes them seperate and apart from God and not fully human as GOd intended them to be because God intended them/us to be WITH Him.

Much like a person that has never loved or been loved and as such has never experienced a realtionship of that sort is "missing something" YET they are still as human as anyone who HAS expereinced love.

In regards to my question about if humans need to be fixed:

I asked the same question at a birthday party of a friends ( his little one just turned 3) and the strange part is that all the people there said Yes, humanity is in need of a fix.

They all stated various views from the acceptance of violence, to hunger and exploitation of people, to what some view as a moral decline, the point was that I didn't need to expand on the question or make it clear so I am not sure why the question seemed so hard to answer here.

PSacramento

I know that sometimes with the going back and forth some posts get overlooked, but I wanted to point out what I posted before:

Post 11246 of 11250
Since 6/22/2009

i got a whiff of that too.

now I will step back again and watch

So, my view that all humans need to be fixed because we are not living up to our potential and my belief that this fix is only available from God is racist and/or homophobic?

Is that what you two are suggesting?

We are all equal and ALL broken, including believers of course. I am pretty sure that I made that clear when I said no one is better than anyone else.

Being a CHristian is accepting that and the knowledge that only God through Christ can Fix that.

It doesn't mean you ARE fixed or superiour to anyone else, it means you have accepted that you need fixing and God is the fixer.

Just to be clear once again, I am not saying that a believer is better than a non-beleiver or that a believer is fixed and the non-believer is broken.

What I said above is how I see us ALL, in need of redemption/fixing and that can only be done through Christ.

That is my opinion and view and I apolgise if it gives the impression that I am making believers out to be superiour.

I am not.

Is this the view of everyother CHristian?

Nope and as I stated before, outside the denominations that are universalists and/or inclusives it is correct that the predominate view is that believers are saved and those that aren't are not saved.

It should be noted though that worshipping God doesn't mean one is saved, as Christ said "Many will come calling saying Lord, Lord and I will say I Knew you Not" ( paraphrasing).

Deputy Dog

PSac

It should be noted though that worshipping God doesn't mean one is saved, as Christ said "Many will come calling saying Lord, Lord and I will say I Knew you Not" ( paraphrasing).

So, are works efficacious or not? Are Humans able to become righteous by making righteous choices?

tec

Faith in God makes one righteous, does it not? At least in the context of this discussion. Abraham believed God and it was credited to him as righteousness.

Peace,

tammy

Deputy Dog

tammy

So "credited to him as righteousness." means becoming righteous, to you?

tec

I'm not sure what you mean, DD. His faith (believing God) was counted to him as righteousness: it means what it says. Paul also spoke of how some men would die for a good man, but very few would do so for a righteous man.

Could you expand upon your point?

thanks.

Peace,

tammy

EntirelyPossible

I said that a person is made fully human AS GOD INTENDED when they accept Christ, that process of becomeing fully human AS GOD INTENDED doesn't just happen with a "snap of the fingers' of course butI think the issue is what do I mean when I say "fully human as God intended".

At the end of the day you are advocating that Christians are more human that non-Christians. Same arguments against gays, black people and women in the past. Same argument, just a new target.

They all stated various views from the acceptance of violence, to hunger and exploitation of people, to what some view as a moral decline, the point was that I didn't need to expand on the question or make it clear so I am not sure why the question seemed so hard to answer here.

Those are all problems some people cause, problems your God endorsed. You have yet to define what "fixed" means or even what is wrong with humanity. It's not hard to answer, you just haven't defined what you mean.

Just to be clear once again, I am not saying that a believer is better than a non-beleiver or that a believer is fixed and the non-believer is broken.

No matter how much you deny it, you are STILL saying that Christians with HS are more fully human that non-Christians. Simply adding in "as God intended" only makes it worrse since it mean God meant for some to be inferior.

Please worship our god or he will kill you!

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