by mP 302 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
To say God himself approves of rape illustrates the stupidity of the tone of this thread, which has mP and Entirely Possible positing that Jesus approved of rape, racism and slavery because they don't see the words they want to see.
Or the stupidity of claiming that I said God approved of rape on this thread. Reading comprehension, you should try it.
Obviously, Christians will want to defend Jesus and the god of the bible whom they believe in.
But it does seem rather pointless for atheists to spend time condemning a non-existent god for appearing to condone the behaviour of humans.
To me, the unchecked barbarity of humans over tens of thousands of years, is proof that such a god, as described in the bible, does not exist.
We can only say that in the opinion of the redactor or editor of the Bible, God condoned it.
Instead they would have us believe that a community of followers who had high ethics (I am speaking of the ideas contained in early Pauline writings, considered genuine by secular scholars, not the pastorals), including the inclusion of women, equality among
members and sharing of property sprang up from a racist slavery approving misogynist.
This is an extreme, unlikely and unfounded position.
Yes, to all.
As to the actual OP, I do not think that I have anything more to say on that matter than what I said to begin with.
The bible and its various books and authors point to Christ... like the law was a tutor leading to Him, like the prophets also pointed to Him. But the bible is not Christ, any more than the law or the prophets are Christ. The bible is not perfect, and it does not give life. It is merely a finger pointing to the One who does give life, and is the Truth.
peace,
tammy
Instead they would have us believe that a community of followers who had high ethics (I am speaking of the ideas contained in early Pauline writings, considered genuine by secular scholars, not the pastorals), including the inclusion of women, equality among members and sharing of property sprang up from a racist slavery approving misogynist.
I know, right, it's like saying a nation that condoned slavery, oppression and misogyny would later fight a war to stop slavery and use that as a springboard to become a leader in promoting human rights.
Oh, wait, that's EXACTLY what happened. Except in the case of the Christians, they have also been using the Bible and that message of love to oppress people for thousands of years to.
P.S. Paul never said women were equal to men or that slavery was bad.
From Entirely Possible:
“That is unheard of in that culture; is it why Mary was called a whore?
She wasn't, not in the Bible, that is a later story.
Where does rape occur and Jesus remain silent?
Jesus never said anythingt about them. The is the definition of "silent".
Your portrayal of Jesus as a racist and misogynist is completely without merit and support.
. 12 apostles and not one of them a woman? Jesus support of women is completely missing. Jesus condemnation of slavery is missing. Jesus condemnation of women as property is missing. Jesus condemnation of all sorts of things is missing. He wasn't terribly supportive of anything other than following him to heaven ”
And then this:
“To say God himself approves of rape illustrates the stupidity of the tone of this thread, which has mP and Entirely Possible positing that Jesus approved of rape, racism and slavery because they don't see the words they want to see.
Or the stupidity of claiming that I said God approved of rape on this thread. Reading comprehension, you should try it.”
Good advice, EP, heed it yourself. I quote you above in support of mP’s idea that Jesus is a racist, slavery approving woman hater, and also quote your misunderstanding of what I said; I said you and mP opine that JESUS approved of rape, not God.
Good advice, EP, heed it yourself. I quote you above in support of mP’s idea that Jesus is a racist, slavery approving woman hater, and also quote your misunderstanding of what I said; I said you and mP opine that JESUS approved of rape, not God.
Please, revisionist history is lame. I never said Jesus OR God approved of rape. You're still striking out. Reading comprehension, you should try it.Or, you know, stop making stuff up. Either one works, but I doubt you will realize your error. People rarely do when they are determined to defend a belief rather that objectively look at fact. Look at all the things Christians have to make up in claiming what the Bible says to even get to semblence of making sense. I can't think of any good reason why, if Christians are willing to make that stuff, you would also make up stuff about other people. Indeed, this is the second time on this thread alone it's happened.
From EP:
P.S. Paul never said women were equal to men or that slavery was bad.
Galatians 3:28--There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
In Paul's early, genuine writings, women were the heads of 'households', the early equivalent of churches. Paul addresses women, Paul acknowledged women, Paul greeted women in writing; that is more than the other apostles, and is not consistent with the overall view of women in his day.
We don't really know how Paul treated women, do we? All we have is the ability to compare what he said with what is known of how women were treated at the time in their culture, and the two ways are different. Even later writings attributed to Paul are back to the same old view of women: they are to be silent and if they have a question, they ask their husbands later. The ancient equivalent of shut up and sit down, or the current radical Muslim view, covered, silent and kept in the home.
And slavery: the discussion of slavery may be a bit misleading on your part. The slavery in the ancient near east was not chattel slavery, as existed in America. Slaves were not property, and became slaves for various reasons. Repugnant and wrong; but not the same as chattel slavery.
Later writings attributed to Paul suggest a writer who IS just fine with slaves; those writings are not in agreement with early Pauline writings.
Please, revisionist history is lame.
What are you on about?
So did Jesus approve of rape or not, EP? You seem full of opinions that he was the same as all others around him.
And you haven't been paying attention: I am not a Christian, or a jew, or a believer.
In Paul's early, genuine writings, women were the heads of 'households', the early equivalent of churches. Paul addresses women, Paul acknowledged women, Paul greeted women in writing; that is more than the other apostles, and is not consistent with the overall view of women in his day.
Paul NEVER said women were equal to men, that scripture not-withstanding. ALL he was saying was that they were all ONE if their faith. Attempting to turn that into a comment about social and legal equality move far beyond the bounds of credulity and imagination.
What are you on about?
You should try reading comrehension. You might like it.
So did Jesus approve of rape or not, EP? You seem full of opinions that he was the same as all others around him.
You have repeated claimed I said he did. Please show me where I said Jesus approved of rape. Once we get that matter settled, then we can move on any other questions you need help with.
And you haven't been paying attention: I am not a Christian, or a jew, or a believer.
You thought I cared. How cute.
