Numbers don't lie :The End of JESUS...

by raymond frantz 90 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  NeverKnew

  Given the statement reflected by the OP (who, to my knowledge may not have been the creator of the website he referenced) and Jeffro - both simply searched for "Jesus." I agree with EdenOne on the mathmatical calculation of those nouns. But counting raw data? there are other factors... what about synonyms to Jehovah? What about the pronouns... would they count?

  Most unfortunately, the number of mentions cannot be used as a barometer of the magnitude of Jesus' significance in the Watchtower. The WTS could write a paragraph like the following:

  Jehovah is greater than Jesus Christ. Christ was the archangel Michael making Him not as significant (no scriptural reference here). Christ said his Fatherwas greater than Himself. Christ said He was powerless without his Father. So, the mature Christian would reasonably conclude that Christ was less thanHis Father and Christ should not be honored in the same light. (please ignore John 5:23)

  I don't know that assessing the numbers would reveal truth here....

  Just curious - on the search feature of the WTS CD, does it distinguish "Christ" from "Christian", "Christianity", and "Christians"?

  Does encircling the word with quotes provide a different result? AND, I thought I read that sometimes the CD fails to find certain articles (ahem) even when the search criteria is accurate.... I'm sorry, I can't give an example off the top of my head - but I could have sworn I read that somewhere.
• 

  EdenOne

  So, if a Christian hears "Jesus" or "Christ", it has a totally different import than if he hears "Jesus Christ"?

  It has if you're analysing statistically the number of ocurrences within a text. Doctrinal difference? Zero.

  Eden
• 

  Jeffro

  NeverKnew:

  Just curious - on the search feature of the WTS CD, does it distinguish "Christ" from "Christian", "Christianity", and "Christians"?

  It will only find the exact word unless an asterisk is added to the end. Searching for Christ will only find Christ, but Christ* will find Christ, Christian, Christmas, etc.

  Does encircling the word with quotes provide a different result?

  Putting a phrase in quotes only matches the exact phrase instead of each separate word. Putting a single word in quotes has no effect.

  AND, I thought I read that sometimes the CD fails to find certain articles (ahem) even when the search criteria is accurate....

  No, there is no basis for that myth. It will even find the embarrassing ones. The Publications Index on the other hand is a bit... selective.

  I'm sorry, I can't give an example off the top of my head - but I could have sworn I read that somewhere.

  I'm aware of the rumor. It just isn't true.
• 

  Jeffro

  NeverKnew:

  Most unfortunately, the number of mentions cannot be used as a barometer of the magnitude of Jesus' significance in the Watchtower. The WTS could write a paragraph like the following:

  Indeed. As I said earlier:

  JW beliefs would not suddenly be 'true' or even 'better' if the magazine simply started referring to Jesus more or meeting some quota for particular words.

  However, the claim was that the use of Jesus in JW literature had significantly decreased since the 1950s. It hasn't. The fact that it hasn't does not make JWs any more or less 'Christian'.
• 

  NeverKnew

  ADMCS: That's not EdenOne's point. Mathmatically, he is correct. If you referred to someone as "John", "Doe", or "John Doe", and you wanted to count the number of times they were referenced, you would use his mathmatical formula of reducing the total by the number of times the individual's full name was used. That's all he's saying....
• 

  AndDontCallMeShirley

  That's not EdenOne's point. Mathmatically, he is correct.

  ----

  Which does nothing to change the claims of the OP.
• 

  Jeffro

  EdenOne:

  Is that what it is? English isn't my native language. To me it's simply algebra.

  The basis for the search operators is indeed Boolean algebra. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boolean_algebra.
• 

  NeverKnew

  I do understand the OPs goal but unfortunately this criteria cannot be used as a barometer. You'd have to read every reference and determine Christ's status - even that type of evaluation would be subjective.

  Jeffro, I don't know about this being a myth. I might be wrong, but I seem to remember asking my JW friend to look something up and it not coming up. This was a couple of years ago so I may have been looking for him to find something else... maybe something pre-1050 WT or pre-? Awake? I'll try to find the example in my notes. I don't want to be embarrassed if I have the opportunity to pose this challenge to another JW.

  Someone from the board was kind enough to mail me a CD but it's for a PC. I own a Mac so I'm unable to do this myself. :(
• 

  EdenOne

  I own a Mac

  I knew there was a reason for me liking you!

  Eden
• 

  Jeffro

  NeverKnew:

  This was a couple of years ago so I may have been looking for him to find something else... maybe something pre-1050 WT or pre-? Awake?

  It obviously won't find publications that simply aren't on the disc. I'm going to assume you meant 1950. There are no issues of The Watchtower prior to 1950 and no issues of Awake! prior to 1970 on the Watchtower Library CD. However, there is no 'selective search results' for those publications that are on the disc.

  I own a Mac

  Sorry to hear that. Is it a pretty colour? I hope it matches your curtains.