Lust For Glory Alienating The Majority? (page 2)

Nordic

Let i go Englishmann, please.

Sunshine great answer!!!

Nordic

Bill is doing a great job, the11and 24 November he is on Danish tv.

refiners fire

..."I feel that some of the more ardent supporters are so focused on this and so driven to make the cause a success that"....

anyone who isnt with them is against them, and any means are usable to achieve the end.

I just erased my response to you. If you think Bowen is brash, abrasive, etc., lol........well, I'm a jw, my daughter was molested by a jw., and I was screwed by several men, including dad, who weren't jw's. Enough to say, I truly take offense at your posts on this matter recently. Truly.

Your continuing of this subject....with yet ANOTHER thread boggles the mind. Give it a rest. You don't like the way Bowen talks to other people? So what. I don't like the way Farkle and you talk to Dungbeetle. Does that make me right/wrong? No. Can I say I disaprove? Yeah. We know you disapprove...we ALL know you disaprove.

Perhaps in a way, you and Bowen have the same tenacity......neither are the type to give up. Both want the right and authority to speak your disapproval, particularily when you think others have been faulted. Perhaps he's from USA Midwest & you're from *polite* Europe.....different styles, but same underlying feature?

Btw, USA Midwest is reknowned for raising some straightass, speak what's on my mind, and kiss-my-ass type of people. Also spawned a lot of serial killers and Al Capone - but that's another story.

I vote for going back to bashing/disagreeing with the WT..........we can ALL agree with that one.

Indiana waiting

Big Tex

waiting

Thanks for saying what I wanted to say.

Nordic

To Englishmann.

I don't care what you think about Bill Bowen, SO SHUT UP!!!

Simon

I think the problem, as ever, is that everyone is commenting based on what they know and have seen. Some have just seen the comments posted on the forums and have not seen the additional things said in emails which often paint a different picture - it is this that makes many of us feel so strongly about things.

It is difficult when posting to only reply to things that have been posted when the words from emails are still in our heads.

Personally, I don't like being told who I can and can't trust and who I should and should not believe or support. I prefer to decide that for myself based on my own experiences with them and it doesn't matter to me if thay can make everyone else think they are 'wonderful' - if I know more about them that says otherwise then I will stick to my guns. Call it determined or stubborn whether you think this is good or not.

onacruse

I have deliberately avoided the vast majority of threads and posts on the BB/RF/SL/JWD/etcetcetc issue...and therefore may well be missing some nuances here.

IMHO, as the saying goes: A man is as a man does...

and an org is as an org does.

Craig

ozziepost

I think it may be worth remembering a past controversy that arose from accusations made under the name of Silentlambs: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.aspx?id=35544&site=3

I would suggest that this episode sowed the seed of the present controversy.

LoneWolf

Sorry, Folks, I'm with Englishman.

This is not the time for this subject to end, and it won 't as long as most of you have your heads stuck up your nether regions. Bill screwed up, big time. As I put it in another thread, this whiny generation seems to think that they can criticize anyone, anytime, about anything, with or without proof, and anyone who objects is out of place.

But should anyone point out their faults --- whew! Listen to the crying, wailing --- and the demanding to avoid all reality --- that ensues. I've had a bellyful of spoiled brats.

SunshineToo ---

Does that make Bill disqualified for his job? I don't think so. Does that make the Silent Lambs look bad? Possible. But remember that Peter denied Jesus 3 times in public, and that didn't make him less qualified for his job.

I think its a little early to say that he is disqualified, but he is certainly heading in that direction if he doesn't straighten up and fly right. And you're right about Peter messing up without being disqualified. However, you're apparently demanding forgiveness for Bill, et. al., when you are not willing to give that same forgiveness to others. That's a two way street, and if you aren't willing to give it, then don't expect any in return.

What Bill and many of his backers apparently cannot see is that while he has accomplished much, a great deal of it was built on the foundation that others have laid. The cornerstone of that foundation was laid by Ray Franz. Many, many others have contributed, and even if very few know of them or what they did, their cumulative effects have made his efforts possible.

If he or anyone else thinks that he has the authority, moral or otherwise, to demand that they back him regardless of their strength, knowledge of the subject, circumstances, or any other consideration, then he is a conceited ass and richly deserving of a good reaming. That is especially true if he (or they) jump to conclusions and cast aspersions on their motives for not doing so.

Look at it this way. Barbara Anderson brought in and indoctrinated over 50 people to the Organization. Why aren't you condemning her for this? Bill himself wrote last week in his "last" post that there were many things that he did while an elder that he is deeply ashamed of. Why should he be trusted in view of that?

Lets face it: we all have done things, usually out of ignorance, that we regret.

The one who screwed up here, was, is, and apparently will continue to be, Bill --- for opening his big yap against RF in the first place. When others point this out, quit whining about it and face the facts.

RevMalk ---

Bottom line is, the issue should be dead. The guy doesn't want to help, so be it, it's just not his bag to save innocent children, what can we do?

No, the issue should not be dead. Especially that is so when knotheads like you continue to slander other people's good name. Your asinine words "it's just not his bag to save innocent children" is a good case in point. Where do you come off assuming anything about what he feels about anything? I can think of about 5 different scenarios where he would not feel free to speak up now --- or even ever.

The time when this subject should die is whenever numbskulls like you quit your nonsense, and not before. If that takes 5 days, 50 months, or 500 years, that's tough. You need to get it through your thick skulls that you don't have that kind of intelligence. If it takes a sledgehammer to do it, so be it.

Nordic ---

I don't care what you think about Bill Bowen, SO SHUT UP!!!

Shut up and sit down, punk. Maybe your brains will work better when you're sitting on them.

waiting --- I'm a bit surprised at you. Youve been around long enough to know that sometimes the best friends a person can have are those who have the courage to look you square in the eye and tell you what you're full of and why. They will be the ones that care enough about you and what you are doing to want to see you succeed. The bootlickers and yes-men can be your worst enemies, for they will allow you to go on your merry way and fall into the traps that lay in your path while not saying a word in warning. A true leader knows this and values opposing opinions.

That is all that has happened in this instance. Many of us can see a critical mistake that Bill has made that is going to sink him unless he gets his head down out of the clouds and corrects it. That mistake doesn't involve his attack on RF, as much as it does his arrogant attitude about it.

You should know this.

LoneWolf

Edited to put the apostraphes back in. They get eliminated whenever I paste from Word to here.

Edited by - LoneWolf on 23 November 2002 8:10:18

Edited by - LoneWolf on 23 November 2002 9:3:32

Lust For Glory Alienating The Majority?

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