born again Christians (page 6)

LittleToe

Spanner:

You haven't answered my questions, and you know it!

On the contrary, I have, as I indicated. It appears that you just don't know it. GentlyFeral is ahead of the game, on this one.

Peace, bro.

Billygoat

What about JT's point that if you're a Buddhist, Muslim, Hindu, etc., and have never come to Christ you're damned!

The big difference here though Dansk is that true Christians KNOW they can NOT make that judgement. Are you a Christian? No. Do I think you're damned? I don't know - I can NOT answer yes or no. I cannot read your heart and do not understand your relationship with God. If a Christian tells you that you are damned to hell - don't believe them. Why? Number one they aren't God and can't read your heart. It burns me to NO END when my fellow Christians point accusatory fingers at others like that! IT'S NOT THEIR PLACE!!!

I think the bottom line is that if one's religion makes them feel good and contains immense altruism, then, fine, that's great - as long as it isn't shoved onto others.

When people like Little Toe and I share our beliefs, please know that we are very sensitive to NOT shoving it onto you or anyone else. (We've done that before, right? Would you like a free home bible study? LOL!) Our lives have been so dramatically changed by being "Born Again" it's hard to NOT share what we believe. Why? Because our new lives have so much joy, kindness, love to offer others. We are not here to judge or strong arm you into believing anything. It's a mite like a dieter that swears by his way of losing weight. He's so excited by what has happened in his own life he can't wait to share his excitement and joy with others!

I just get the impression that most people have this NEED to believe in something. The story of Jesus is a nice one because he laid down his life so that anyone believing in him can be saved. Yes, wonderful - but is it true? One cannot just pick up the Bible and say it is true. One has to PROVE it is true. Unfortunately, there's more evidence today AGAINST it's being inspired of God than there is in its favour.

Having faith in something is not always a reasonable or logical act. More often than not it goes against what is logical. All I know is that I do have faith in the Christ and God of the Bible. The times I struggled MOST in life are the times that my faith was strengthened most. Strengthened because the faith I had gave me a peace that God is taking care of things. I don't have to worry so badly. I had a peace knowing that even though I struggle, I struggle temporarily. There is something better waiting for me on another day, another time. Every struggle on this earth is temporal. But what's so funny is that when I truly let go and let faith take it's course, I win out better than if I had forced the issue my own way. To me faith is a lot of being patient and watching events unfold before me instead of me trying to take control of the event itself.

I've got other comments, but wanted to get this out for now. Dansk, I truly appreciate your willingness to at least listen to an opposite opinion and experience. There are so many here that can argue, but can "fight fair". Thanks for letting us share!

Andi

Billygoat

BUT - what the heck do I know - I'm learning this as I go along. I ditched all my JW beliefs and preconceptions, like a shroud, and started from scratch.

Thank you LT for the reminder. This is where I'm at too!

SpannerintheWorks

Gentlyferal,

Spanner (to LittleToe):
So essentially what you are saying is that you must be "born again" to become a Christian, which leads to an eternal existence with God?
No, if you read LT's last post, he's perfectly willing to cut the "Christian" middleman out altogether, if that's the way it happens to *you*.

HA! See Littletoe's reply, viz:

Spanner:

So essentially what you are saying is that you must be "born again" to become a Christian, which leads to an eternal existence with God?

That much I'll concede overtly, and would heartily recommend it to you as something to seek.

NO! Littletoe, you have NOT answered my questions!!! Answer this:

So essentially what you are saying is that you must be "born again" to become a Christian, which leads to an eternal existence with God?
SO, correct me if I am wrong, "born again" Christians are the only "true" Christians, and the only Christians (and indeed people, period), who will gain this "eternal life" and ALL other Christians/people will become "manure", as you put it?

Still waiting for a reply to my questions...?

I posted that OVER THREE HOURS AGO!!!

You know, if you have time constraints, a quick "yes" or "no" will suffice!

Spanner

JamesThomas

True mystics throughout the ages have pretty much agreed on the message from Infinity: that which some have come to call "God". The Source of all that is.

"I am not in the Universe.
The Universe is in Me.
Which means: I have never been, nor will I ever be, anywhere more present, than where you are -- right now.
To the degree that you make Me holier or more present in any one person or place -- is the degree that you belittle and subtract Me from everyone and everywhere else.
Any seeming absence is due to no weakness of Mine, but rather your being so filled with beliefs as to be blind. Remove everything from you that can be removed, and then tell me what is left. What is there then?
Be still and know,
I AM "

JamesT

Billygoat

I posted that OVER THREE HOURS AGO!!!

Just because someone doesn't answer in the time frame YOU feel they should doesn't mean they are ignoring you. Maybe LT Perhaps LT has a job and needs to work. I just happen to be on my lunch, but here in a min I won't be able to answer. Is it really worth this debate to get all worked up??? Another question might be WHY are you getting so worked up??? Why does that push your buttons so badly???

Usually it's us Born Againers that are accused of getting too emotional. Haha! (That's a joke!)

Dansk

LittleToe,

The link you post proves nothing and is undoubtedly biased. Origen, one of the Church Fathers, is mentioned as though he was someone of learning and substance. The truth is, Origen believed the sun, moon and the stars were living creatures enowed with reason and free will and OCCASIONALLY INCLINED TO SIN! The other Church Fathers are no better. This is what I mean. How on earth can anyone believe in the BIble when it was put together by clots such as these!!

Dansk

SpannerintheWorks

Sorry, Billygoat, but that whole post is based on a misconception! LT was on line less than half an hour before you sent that post! Anyway, what has that to do with this debate?

Usually it's us Born Againers that are accused of getting too emotional

Eh...that is not the way to prove your point!

Spanner

Dansk

Billygoat, you wrote:

There is something better waiting for me on another day, another time. Every struggle on this earth is temporal.

Can’t agree more – and thanks for your eloquent post. To me, what you stated above is similar to JT’s

True mystics throughout the ages have pretty much agreed on the message from Infinity: that which some have come to call "God". The Source of all that is.

Amen, JT. Karma, that’s my belief!

Oh, er, JT. How about one of your wonderful pictures to take the heat out of this thread!

Dansk

LittleToe

Spanner:
I've just got home from work - the delay, and distraction from posting was due to workload.
FYI I live in Scotland, probably several timezones away from you.

Actually, though I gave you a reply to the point that GentlyFeral made, I may also concur with her point with no contradiction. Whether I do or not, I will leave you to guess, however you would probably find your answer from my exchange with her.

I don't owe you any answer, my friend. In fact your demanding them with CAPS kinda inclines me to ignore you. Neither do I need to give you yes or no answers. What right do you have to demand them?
This, btw, is one of the few buttons that I have. It ranks right up there with telling me what I believe and adamantly refusing to accept any evidence to the contrary!

Meanwhile - peace

GentlyFeral:
On the way home from work, I reconsidered your point, that I directly addressed. Your way around could well be more correct, or equally plausible... whatever.
I'll give it some continued thought.

Billygoat:
I love your posts, on this thread.
The more I read, the more gutted I am that we never got to meet in Dallas.
Hope you and the other half are doing well.

born again Christians

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