Posts by Phizzy

18

Child abuse calculations

by Anony Mous in

there are no real numbers for jws but they are a relatively small group.

compared to the number of catholics at least.. the australian commission gathered more than 5000 cases with over 1000 perpetrators that went completely unreported for the jws.

likewise they did the same for catholics and collected just under 4800 cases with 1880 perpetrators.

I made a similar calculation some years back, and came to the same conclusion, that the CSA and other Abuse problems were far more prevalent among J.W's than other religions and secular organisations such as the Scouts etc.

Of course 100% solid figures cannot be obtained, but when you add in the number of cases where J.W Elders persuaded parents etc. to sweep the incidents under the carpet, the problem in the J.W Org. was HUGE, and I cannot see that it can have been reduced much in recent years, they have taken no steps to put in place a real Safeguarding Programme, where a safeguarding Officer is active and on duty at all events where J.W's are together, plus the other things such Officers do.

The question is WHY NOT ?? Here in the U.K even small churches and small clubs and Associations have such a system going, there is simply NO EXCUSE for them not to protect the vulnerable, for which they have a Duty of Care.

The J.W Org. always was and remains A Paedophile Paradise.

7

Quoting the Daily Mail at meetings

by Farmer Jim1 in

jw
friends

i've just remembered that i attended a hall where one of the brothers consistently quoted daily mail articles to back up his answers during the meetings.

i found it hard to keep a straight face when the inevitable daily mail article was quoted to 'prove' a bible passage at each meeting.. no one really seemed to mind and i remember one time i spoke to an elder and said this has to stop as he is passing off tabloid tattle as hard fact.. elder wasn't interested.

i guess as long as the answers backed up the party line no one cared..

Phizzy

The Daily Mail , on its Wiki page, used to have a notice on there from Wiki which warned it was not a source for factual information, that notice is probably still there !

" I guess as long as the answers backed up the party line no one cared."

That is the case, in the last few months before I finally walked away all those years ago, I used to give an answer that sounded like it backed the party line, but introduced a subversive idea. Most Elders did not notice, but maybe I planted a seed with someone in the audience ?

I remember one in the old Group Study, held in a private home as they still were back then, we were doing a bit in the old "Revelation" Book about how the U.N was one of the "beasts".

I answered and said about the Org. being "temporarily" a member of the U.N, and made the answer look a bit acceptable by saying that the Org. removed itself as a member, the Elder in charge looked a bit disturbed by what I had said, and merely said "Yes", whereas normally he would agree with an answer with alacrity..

I doubt he, or other people there, realised they were soon cosying up to the U.N again, but I tried !

18

IICSA Final Report

by Phizzy in

the english legal system's independent inquiry into child sexual abuse has issued its final report, and its recommendations.

to read the report in full just google iicsa report, if you search on the iicsa site you can find the specific investigation into j.w's.. but this recommendation from the final report is interesting, esp.

the first and last sentences.

Phizzy

No, they had the second Reading of a Bill to safeguard children of School Age, The Children's Wellbeing and Schools Bill. Which was passed with a huge majority, despite every Right Wing Conservative that could be mustered Voting against the Bill.

The Cons. had put forward to be Voted on first, what is called a Reasoned Amendment, this would have scuppered the Bill, the amendment, as part of it,, called for a new inquiry into sex abuse gangs.

This was doing Elon Musk's bidding, the amendment was Voted down, such an Inquiry would take years, but the Government have not totally ruled out holding one, they are consulting with survivor/victim groups.

To scupper this Bill would have meant that the safeguarding of School Age kids was not in place for a long time.

The Conservatives showed how low they have sunk, no matter how evil his urgings, they will do Musk's bidding. Shocking.

The Government has said the first of the IICSA Report suggested actions, Mandatory Reporting, will be in Law soon, the others will follow. No doubt the Tories will Vote against those soon if Musk tells them to.

14

The Greeks had a word for it, but the Watchtower didn't

by Nathan Natas in

i recall as though it was only 60 years ago, sitting in the kingdom hall on those horrible chairs, learning of the four forms of love: agape, philia, storge and eros.. the watchtower never mentioned pragma.. pragma: this is a committed, compassionate love that often grows as two partners continue to cherish and care for each other.

this type of love is associated with being together for a long time.

in some cases, the passion of eros can grow into pragma over time, this forging a lasting bond.. i think i know why; the watchtower isn't into committed, compassionate, cherishing and caring, are they?.

Phizzy

From Bible Hub :

" In the New Testament, "pragma" generally refers to a matter or affair, often with a focus on practical or concrete aspects. It can denote a business transaction, a legal matter, or a deed. The term emphasizes the tangible or actionable nature of the subject in question."

18

IICSA Final Report

by Phizzy in

the english legal system's independent inquiry into child sexual abuse has issued its final report, and its recommendations.

to read the report in full just google iicsa report, if you search on the iicsa site you can find the specific investigation into j.w's.. but this recommendation from the final report is interesting, esp.

the first and last sentences.

Phizzy

"This will put the government on collision course with the Catholic Church who claim the “ sanctity of the confessional “ B.B.

"The sanctity of the confessional is , obviously, for people who CONFESS their sins. However if a child goes to a priest to report that they have been abused then that isn't a confession."

In U.K Law if a Priest uncovers a crime he is already duty bound to report it, the fact he learned it in the Confessional is irrelevant. This has been the case since the Reformation.

The loophole that will be closed is that a priest can claim he has not uncovered a crime where what is confessed does not at present constitute one, in HIS opinion, the same applies to an Elder, they will have to report first, and it is up to the authorities to say if a crime has been committed.

9

Big Local Case, Sexual Abuse by former Elder, Police Raided the Kingdom Hall ! Kent, U.K !

by Phizzy in

the police have started an investigation where a woman has courageously come forward about her sexual abuse by a former elder, who had a record of doing such things with the local congregation, and i think it was all covered up.

they have charged him, he is claiming he is not mentally fit to appear in court, i hope that lie does not hold up !.

this case was unknown to the local elders, but hopefully will now give the strength for other women, who were all very young and very vulnerable at the time , to come forward as well.

Phizzy

I will not identify the Hall on here, as it may identify the individual and prejudice the case against the Monster.

Assuming it comes to Court, and I really hope it does ! I will tell all.

18

Removed - blood card

by skin in

i overheard a discussion between two jws, they said that when someone is disfellowshipped, they are asked to hand their blood card back to the elders.

i had never heard of this before, is this correct?.

Phizzy

If I had been DF'd I would not have had a card to hand back, I never filled one in or carried one when I was a J.W.

It was strange thinking about it, I had never thought about the blood nonsense hardly, I did that after I left, and asked my Doctor to remove any reference to it from my Records, and any ref. to me being a J.W. he assured me no such records had ever been on there ! LOL, I hadn't done that either.

I think the reason I did not do any of that crap was the feeling that is natural to me, since I was very young, just a boy, to never obey "authority" if I cannot see good reasons as to why I should.

The move to stop all that, to do with Blood cards, was definitely the fear the Org. has of litigation, The Legal Dept. guide them on this, as in so much, where is the Holy Spirit one wonders ? LOL.

When the Org. makes ANY move, it is always about the $$$.

113

Luke 23:43 the NWT

by Ade in

luke 23:43 - and jesus said to him, "positively i say to you, today you will be with me in paradise.

nwt places comma here , giving a totally different meaning to the verse.

now the average jw uses this to back their doctrine and it seems in itself virtually impossible to reason with them on it.

Phizzy

One Commentator wrote :

Σήμερον, to-day) On that day the converted robber could have hardly looked for death.[262] But the breaking of the legs was made subservient to this end. Thereby the Lord’s promise was fulfilled. [The marking of the time by the expression, to-day, is not to be referred (joined) to the verb, I say, as if the robber should have to wait for his entrance into Paradise during I know not how long periods of time. That the words were spoken to him on that day, is of itself evident (without it being necessary to say so). Jesus never used the expression, To-day I say; whereas He repeatedly used the expression, I say. Therefore we must read the words thus, To-day shalt thou be with Me in paradise. Thus the power and grace of the Lord, and also His own ready and immediate entrance into Paradise, is openly declared.—V. g. That was indeed to save, Luke 23:39 (which the impenitent robber had taunted Him with, as unable to effect it).—Harm., p. 570].—μετʼ ἐμοῦ, with me) Much more then did Jesus Himself come to Paradise. [A fact which must have been very consolatory to Mary, wife of Cleopas, and Mary Magdalene, against men’s bitter taunts, and to the Virgin mother and John, when communicated to them.

10

Pella

by peacefulpete in

this short thread addresses the often-repeated legend that christians fled jerusalem to pella and escaped the destruction of jerusalem.

the legend is based upon two 4th century comments.. .

the whole body, however, of the church at jerusalem, having been commanded by a divine revelation given to men of approved piety there before the war, removed from the city to a certain town beyond the jordan called pella.

Phizzy

Thanks once again for a fascinating and informative Thread P.P.

Having been aware for a long time that the Gospel of Mark was a work of Fiction in the main, but of the Gospel Genre, it has also been long in my mind that this "Prophecy" was written after the event, using the methodology of the Writer of Daniel, but to have it confirmed that this was a very late interpolation is satisfying.

Thinking on it, Luke 21v21 must be a late interpolation too ?

51

They are running out of people to do their stuff.

by liam in

this is the watchtower study article being studied today.

so it’s the current new light!.

what are the new qualifications to be an “elder-aka older man...and circuit overseer?.

Phizzy

In a chat I had the other day with one of my sons, he told me he went for a drink with two old J.W friends, one lad is out completely, and his lovely wife was never a J.W. The other lad is sort of physically in, as he runs a business with some J.W's in, so goes along to "keep up appearances".

He told my son of all the ones who were around their age that have left, and of the many that are PIMO, who just show up at a Meeting about once a Month !

No wonder they are running out of people to do all the actual boring tasks, that are beneath Elders to do.