Posts by Vienna

18

JW question

by Vienna in

jw
friends

quick question i haven't been able to get an answer:.

we all are human.

we all have the same makeup.

Vienna

Quick question I haven't been able to get an answer:

We all are human. We all have the same makeup. We all have a physical body.

If you believe that only 144,000 go to heaven, that means that you believe only 144,000 people have a physical body and a spirit soul that is taken to heaven by God. Those ones aren't recreated in heaven--they are "taken" to heaven. What is getting "taken" to heaven, not their physical body. It's their soul.

God didn't create only 144,000 humans with spirit bodies that he then carries to heaven upon their death. And JW claims there are some 144,000 who fall away, what happens to their spirit body that was supposed to go to heaven?

Our brain--it's not just flesh. Our memory and thoughts can't be touched because they are electrons. When you look into
someone's eyes, you see their eyeballs, but what is it that is behind it? We are breathing, but what is that keeps our lungs
moving? We are physical, but we all have a spirit lifeforce in us that makes us US.

That goes somewhere when we die.

If you believe God is only taking a few of those souls to heaven, where are all of the rest of us going?

I know the answer...just curious from the JW point of view.

28

Truth hurts

by Decidedly_Unsure in

jw
friends

i can't believe it's all a sham!

remember before i was baptized, i wondered onto a hostile site and felt a sickening dread, when i confronted the sister who studied with me she reassured me that i shouldn't worry, all the stuff on those sites are written by bitter outcasts who have nothing constructive to offer, "after all", she said, ""did you ever read anything upbuilding there?

" well, here i am baptized, back on the net 4 years later and wham!!

Vienna

Well, after reading Circe's post, I didn't tell much about myself after leaving. Thanks for your post circe--I enjoyed reading about you.

I am an ex-JW, my husband is also ex-JW, we have a baby and three cats. I was rasied a JW and baptised at 18, and pretty much lead a good JW life. When I was 25, I was introduced to scriptures that showed things that proved the WT wasn't following the Bible (and a long list of other stuff). I left, of course saddened that my family is still in, but not angry in the slightest against JWs. I love them all.

Now I attend church (only a Bible teaching church which was important to me) where I volunteer in working in the church's nursery and stuffing bullentins for Sunday worship. I attend a "bookstudy" *smile* which is actually called a Community Group on Wednesday nights where we study the Bible and have fellowship, like the JW bookstudies. Right now we are studying 1 Timothy, and at all meetings we take it verse by verse, using a bible study guide. The only bad thing is that people bring desserts after the bible study, and it's not helping my diet!!!! LOL :)

Like circe, I don't view everyone as "worldly" anymore, but I DO recognize that some people are not good association simply for things like drug use, drinking in excess, etc., therefore some people I don't buddy with because of the differances in lifestyle. Not that I'm God to judge their every move and condemn them to death (like Witnesses do when they see people not conforming), but just plain ole "birds of a feather" theory--you hang out with people with your same interests.
__________________________
Quote from circe:
I get to watch the people walking by in the park without thinking "Oh those poor people, they don't have The Truth(tm). I hope they get it soon or they are all going to DIE!" Instead I watch them and think "I wonder what they believe about God? I wonder if they are good people? Do they have kids? What are their lives like?" And if they look like they need help, I know I can offer help without feeling like a hypocrite because it was drummed into my brain that if I really wanted to help them I would offer a Free Home Bible Study, instead of food, money or a blanket. Sigh.
___________________
Ain't that the truth??? I'm currently in training and volunteering to help pregnant women in crisis situations and I was thinking this week "If I were a witness, I couldn't do this! I could only invite them to the Kingdom Hall!" Now I can help people in real life situations and still let them know the love of God without beating them on the head with it.

Life for me is better than I ever knew it could be after leaving the JWs. I honestly, honestly never knew such a life like this existed. I feel no anger or bitterness, and JWs are not stupid, just misdirected.

6

Ahhhhhhhhh, another happy dub start. :(

by outcast in

jw
friends

.

http://www.witnessesonline.com/cgi-bin/cgiwrap/witnessesonline/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=11&t=000047

Vienna

Not that being subject to your husband is wrong--it's the way God wants it, but NOT the way the WT uses it!!!

The WT uses it as "HE takes out the group, HE handles talks, HE does the sound, etc., so bow to him because HE's an elder or MS, not you, you worthless chick! Just make him look good by going to the meetings and going out in service. Otherwise, SHUT UP!!!!!" LOL

I enjoy having my husband as head--we are both out of the WT. But now I feel complete as his partner, not the silent braindead body that just sat there in the second sit next to him in the Kingdom Hall. I realized that's not how God sees women. Praise Him! :)

28

Truth hurts

by Decidedly_Unsure in

jw
friends

i can't believe it's all a sham!

remember before i was baptized, i wondered onto a hostile site and felt a sickening dread, when i confronted the sister who studied with me she reassured me that i shouldn't worry, all the stuff on those sites are written by bitter outcasts who have nothing constructive to offer, "after all", she said, ""did you ever read anything upbuilding there?

" well, here i am baptized, back on the net 4 years later and wham!!

Vienna

Personally, I see a trend of those who think that this board is "negative" coming from those who are JWs. Imagine if we came across a discussion board that only talked about members of our immediate family, discussing their personalities--be it good or bad, looking into their past, etc., I would take it as an attack on my family, how DARE anyone take a close look at my family. But in reality, it's not an attack. It's board that's looking into all areas of that family's life, from everything they say to what they do. Just the facts.

That's what this board is. Just the facts on the WT, all areas, uncensored. We just expose the bare WT underbelly that unfortunately is hiding lots of stuff.

I use this illustration all the time:

When I was a JW and if I were put in a room with no windows and someone asked me what the weather is, I would say I don't know. If someone told me "The Society says it's raining, but if you want you can go outside of this room and find out." I would of said "No way! It's raining! I don't need to leave this room to find out because the Society said it's raining. No need to do what they've already done." But in reality, it would actually been snowing. Would I of ever found out?? I look back and want to cry at how much thinking I let them do for me, at the cost my very salvation.

If you have the right Jesus, you're right for eternity. If you have the wrong Jesus, you're wrong for eternity.

Don't let someone "tell" you which Jesus that is. Find out for yourself.

22

Should you write to the society?

by sleepy in

jw
friends

when someone comes across something in the "truth" that disterbs them should they write to the society or is this pointless?.

i think they should write for several reasons.. 1.you must give them at least a chance to present their side of the story.it is no good just relying for others for your information you can not be shure what the society really belive until you hear it from them yourself.. wasn't just relying on the judgement of others part of what got you in in the first place.. its good for us to try and advance in our way of thinking during life and part of this involves doing our own research which is not complete until we go to the source of our conflict.. also if you bring up the point with someone it gives more weight to your argument if mention you wrote to the society and this was their answer.. 2. the more poeple that write in with the same points the more difficult it will be for them to hold to an erroneous stand.. the more different people that write the more ways of expresing the point will be heared different ways will make sence to different people.. remember its not just the same person answering all letters but different people who will have to do research an answer your point, which could make them think.. (this assumes that the society is genuinely mistaken and not corupt, although it could be a bit of both).

of cource if you do not want hassle off your elders dont tell the society you are a brother/sister or just give a different name ,prehaps you could give the address of your place of work or somewhere else if you don't want to be traced easily.. in my case i just made it sound like i was an intrested person.. or you could make out that you need some help in presenting the societies case to an intrested person who has quetions.

Vienna

Troubled:

Please be warned--if you are writing the letter to the Society with the purpose of saying "hey, you guys can not answer these questions, but here they are anyway because you're wrong", then be prepared to be disfellowshiped for apostasy. Once the elders get a copy of the letter from the WT headquarters, they'll send out the investigative committee to meet with you. They sum it up nowadays with this simple question: "Do you believe that Jehovah's Witnesses are used by Jehovah's as his spirit directed organization?" If you answer yes, then you're okay. That IMMEDIATELY means all of your questions fall under basic WT teachings, so you're not an enemy, you just have questions.

If you answer no, you're out and labeled an apostate. If you send in that letter, be prepared to make a stand either for the WT or not--there's no black or white. There used to be years ago, but with the increase in those leaving, elders are told to keep it simple. I know from experience with myself and my husband. They asked my husband that same question, and it cuts to the chase (both of us are out of the JWs now, we are Christains and are happy....finally!!!).

What direction is your letter taking...I'm just curious....

24

Motives

by msil in

jw
friends

what are your motives for being here?.

1. to get information.

2. to slam the wtbs at every opportunity.

Vienna

Hey, bboyneko, I think GodRules IS Prince in disguise!!!

Can I get your autograph?? ;)

35

A Question thats troubling me........

by aud8 in

jw
friends

"this good news will be preached for a witness to all the inhabited nations and then the end will come" nobody else is preaching any good news as far as i can see?

what do you think?

Vienna

Well, I'm a witness. I'm not a JW (left that three years ago), but I do look for chances to witness to people I met about the TRUE good news of the bible. I also volunteer at a crisis center where we help people to get through knowing God and hopefully seeking a relationship with Him.

Just in my small part of the world, I know two churches that go out and knock of doors of people regularly. My best friend, who was NEVER a JW, looks for chances to witness, for instance, when she's traveling on a plane, she'll look out of the window and say to the person next to her "Isn't that a beautiful scence? Seeing things that like always makes me appreciate that we have such a loving creator who designed it all." and it leads her into some great conversations with people (I've told her I'm stealing that one from her :)

So, please don't be closed minded in thinking only JWs do that and/or that scripture is not happening, because that's so far from the truth it's ridiculous. We have missionaires in our church who regularly go to Suriname. Our team is responsible for running two Vacation Bible Schools, leading services and youth meetings, and home Bible studies (HOME BIBLES STUDIES??? Sound familar?????? *wink*).

That's just in my small part of the world. There are missionaires in Hong Kong, China, Alaska....geez...the list of way too long, the people way too numerous, but you get the point.

The world is big--the scope of things is sometimes hard to grasp when we know nothing of it. I learned of this stuff AFTER I left the JWs, and felt lied to about how they claimed to be the only ones who witness. WHAT A JOKE. There are people who are dying today in Columbia because they are Christians (persuction is bad there). There are people dying all over the world for their faith, and I'm NOT talking about the JW faith, but the real Jesus of the bible. How did those people find out about Jesus? Because of the "good news" that is being spread. Jesus' words will and are being fulfilled in that scripture.

25

Help for a non-Witness

by hagey in

jw
friends

i'm looking for anyone who is married to a non-witness, or someone who themselves is not a witness but is married to one.

i'm in desperate need of advice and don't know where else to turn.

i myself am not a witness but my girlfriend is and our religous differences are forcing us apart.

Vienna

The biggest thing that helped me come out was the Bible. I was shown scripture after scripture of things that the WT did that wasn't in line with what the Bible actually taught (real Bible translations compared to their New World's Translation). Once I saw they didn't teach correct doctrine, the rest fell in place--the false prophecies, the leaders making up their own theology, etc. You need to come at her with facts, not emotion. You can e-mail me for further information, if you want.

But of course, that's a long process (and maybe even after that she'll never leave), and I can understand you want an immediate resolution. Look at the facts: I can see your main concern is your future children, which is very practical to consider. Not just the blood issue (which is too serious to leave up in the air--it's a life or death decision, please remember that), Jehovah's Witness children can have no Christmas, no birthday's, no Thanksgiving, they can't say the pledge of allegence in school, 4th of July fireworks is considered wrong because of the patriotic aspect, they can't be apart of after school things like football, cheerleading, etc., they can't have any friends who aren't Jehovah's Witnesses. They are expected to go in field service with their parents on Saturday's when most kids are leading normal lives playing with friends. They are expected to not only study for all of the meetings with their parents (five meetings a week), but they are pressured to comment also. THE LIST IS ENDLESS! These are JW rules, and not from our loving heavenly Father. Jesus came to lighten our load, not make it heavier. The older a JW kids get, they are expected to do more (for boys, they are expected to have duties at the Kingdom Hall and if they don't do it, they are considered not in "good standing"). Just is just words, but the truth is, there is so much JW kids are put through, emotionally and mentally. I was raised a JW, and like me and others on this board know, it's an unfairly hard life to grow up in.

You are dealing with a cult, this is not just "some religion" as I'm sure you're starting to see. And I hate to tell you this, but I know of many situations like this were the kids grow up as JWs, and KIDS AND THE WIFE end up leaving the "worldly" mate because he/she never accepts it as the "truth". It happened to a friend of mine, and now he is left alone, his three kids willingly gone to service the WT with their mom.

9

Can anyone answer?

by Kent in

jw
friends

i just got this e-mail, and i'd like to give the guy an answer.

can anyone tell me the recent policy?.

my name is xxxxxx and i am a totally blind braille user and have been blind sense birth.

Vienna

When I was a JW, one of my good friends was blind. They had made him a Ministerial Servant, and unlike this person, he was not only allowed to go out in FS, but he was a regular pioneer. As regards to him getting a career/job, he was pretty much on his own and he had a hard time at it. The congregation didn't help in any way. They only time they offered to help was to make sure he had a ride to the meetings, and everyone felt the need to invite him to all the gatherings. Being blind AND a regular pioneer really put him in the "he's such a good role model" category, and you know once you get there you're in the in crowd. But I was happy for him at the time, like I said, he was my friend and I liked that people were so friendly as to have him over to their houses all the time. But if he wasn't a pioneer, I don't know how much of that would of occurred, because people always said they knew how broke he was not working fulltime in order to pioneer--people felt sorry for him alot. You know, the conditional "love" that easily disappears under the right circumstances. We've all seen it, and if the Lord wills it, he'll see it one day and hopefully come out (after learning about the other 123,231 things that are wrong with the WT).

But overall, he was expected to follow all JW rules just like everyone else. Here's your paddle kid--now row!!!

30

Now That I've Joined, I wish That I Hadn't

by TR in

jw
friends

any one here get that sinking feeling when you were an active jw?

i'm not talking about the point where we developed doubts about the borg, but just the shear weight of responsibility on your shoulders to uphold "god's kingdom" ala wts.. the topic of doing all you can was brought up frequently.

some would try to sooth by saying "as long as you're doing your best, jehovah will accept you.

Vienna

Reading someone's post on always being sick reminded me: I used to HOPE I would get some problem and be so sick I didn't have to attend. That way, it would be a free ticket to not go to the meetings and people wouldn't judge me for not showing up. I remember daydreaming I had a major illness, they had to make an annoucement about the need to send meals or something and I would daydream the congregation feeling sorry for me and say "I know why she's not here--poor thing." How pathetic is that for me to wish that??? I felt like a rat that needs to chew on its own leg to get out of a trap--no matter the physical pain, I want out! I got so jealous of the men and women who had real problems and when they finally showed up to a meeting everyone would rush to them and congradulation them on coming. But if I missed ONE meeting for a headache or sore back (not good enough reasons, remember) , I would get the critical eye and up turned nose. Crazy.