Hi I hope i am welcome (page 12)

cantleave

Guys not Guts!!!!!! Cantleave cant type - lol

reniaa

hi cantleave

you called gb 'Control freak organisation' that squarely puts your issues down to leadership not doctrine am I correct?

I cannot change anyones mind. People can only change themselves, when people are questioning leaders right to lead and their authority and practises I recommend reading all of Pauls books in the bible it's enlightening on the sheer work and organisation involved, so many issues the same as you deal with today.

Next look at any other organisation either political, religious or secular and find they are all the same in these issues. leaders lead and you either like it or lump it. 40 years is a lot of investment but Jehovah is worth it and so is his son Jesus. Have you thought about looking again at what you found so strong in the beliefs in the first place the basics that make jehovah's witnesses unique amongst christianity in doctrine? belief in One God, earthly resurrection, Jesus is actually Gods beloved son.

Reniaa

flipper

CANTLEAVE- I too have noticed the " control freak " tendencies of the witness organization. And it's not only issues of leadership that cause the control- but the WT society uses ever changing views of their " doctrines " to exert that control . What I mean is one minute 1935 was considered the end of the anointed being gathered. The sealing of the anointed was complete. The next thing you know - the sealing is opened up again . Now instead of the number partaking going down each year ( used to be 8, 000 and dropping ) the last report indicated almost 10,000 partaking ! What gives ? Did Jehovah NOT select that many in the 1st century to be of the anointed ? Will the number explode to 20,000 within a few years ?

Also - Being raised in the witnesses for 44 years I was always taught that a " generation " was about 70 or 80 years. As Jehovah's Witnesses we were taught that Armageddon would come in our lifetime. People built their lives around that promise. I was 16 in 1975 ( the year the witnesses predicted the end ) and was told I was very fortunate because I'd be able to raise my children in the " paradise ". Well- I'll be 50 in October and guess what ? My son is 24, and 2 daughters are 22 and 20. No paradise yet. In last years " witness only " Watchtower it stated that we don't know HOW LONG a generation may be. It's been 95 years since 1914. If you look up in an English language dictionary it will state that a generation's length is considered to be 30 years tops- perhaps 40 years. From when we are born until we have children, then our children are a NEW generation.

So the WT society expects ALL Jehovah's Witnesses to go along with these ever changing doctrines without question. You are NOT allowed to question the GB. If you do- you are considered unfaithful. Or controlled by Satan. To make it easier to accept these changes- the WT society calls it " new light " . Even if you disagree and preferred the " old light ". Could it be that because of failed interpretations of the timetables of what a " generation " really is - now the WT society is scrambling to make their " doctrines " appear trustworthy ? Just a thought. So one poster said it's just about leadership. I'm here to say it's about doctrine as well. Take care, Peace out, Mr. Flipper

cantleave

Reniaa,

Most other organisations do not claim to be the exclusive channel through which a person can build a relationship with God, except of course other religions. I expect political leaders to be corrupt, they are generally self serving or at least serving their party. I expect business leaders to show little moral backbone, they need to compete in a dog eat dog world to make enough profit to satisfy all their stakeholders.

The GB on the other hand are very quick to criticise the political and business leaders saying they are part of Satan's world, so I expect the GB to act differently. I expect them to disseminate information accurately and honestly. I expect them to appoint CO's who will support the rank and file in the Congregation and not listen to lies and rumours spread by some ambitious, nepotistic elders who don't care for sheep they are entrusted to take care of. I don't expect the GB to add or take away from scripture. Jehovah is almighty he has the ability to direct and control the nuclear fusion process in trillions of stars in billions of galaxies, so surely he would control the leaders who represent him so that they don't make mistakes that cause heartache and pain to so many.

In terms of going back to basics that is exactly what I am doing. I am re-evaluating what my faith means to me. I am studying things with an open mind, I refuse to be influenced by anyone's (or organisation's) preconcieved ideas. I really am doing what I have been advised by the society, taking my personal study very seriously. I am starting by reading the bible, checking to see with more sources than you can imagine, whether the interpretation I have been sold for my entire life really stacks up.

I am not looking to prove the WTS wrong, quite the opposite, as I said right at the beginning of this thread, the "truth" has been the centre of my life everyone I love is a Witness. I run my own business and most of my clients and employees are witnesses. But I cannot live a lie, I can't have my children growing up in isolation from normal society for a heap of false promises. I did not dedicate myself to live in the new system, I did so because because I am grateful for what God has provided, so dates have never been important me. However, I am coming to the conclusion that most witnesses are in it to get a reward, and the WTS uses that as a stick to beat them with. If you don't do what they say you will not get that reward. So they can say what they like and throw in a scripture to justify it and over 6 million people go along with it.

I am never going to get involved in arguments about silly illogical doctrines like the Trinity or Hellfire on here because they are not important to me and I don't care what anyone else thinks.

awildflower

You know, if this org is the best Holy Spirit can do, then we're all in trouble! I for one think the JW org underestimates the Holy Spirit of the universe and that's a shame.........wf

DaCheech

hey cantleave, power to you.

when I used to go to "witness gettogethers" there was always some bethellite that had to have the last word in "spiritual conversation". I hated how they nitpicked to find the little details to "principles" and "future prophecies". these guys always wanted you to know the unknowable.

I think, if god is true, and he put us here as mere flesh, the minor details should have no need (for us to think we need to know).

anyway, remember many of us here have been many years in the lie, I have been more than 30odd years myself.

we can't all be seeing things wrong for nil?

mouthy

JANDO~!!!!!Just noticed this is your first post WELCOME Nice to have you aboard...
Cantleavenow!!!!! I liked your answer to our little Jehovah's Witness aboard..

I hope she will listen to you... She really is a sweetie...

Spike Tassel

Spike Tassel (Post 63) re cantleave (Post 14): Yes, it certainly is refreshing to be involved in such open, supportive discussions. True love surely does trump the application of mere law. After all, our goal ought to be to help all (whether friend or foe or someone more neutrally placed) to improve in their abilities to "widen out" in their love. Characterisations such as "control freak organisation" hardly are appealing. So, perhaps we could focus on the good, and support that. In doing so, those who may have "control freak tendencies" may tone down their rhetoric and become more loving to us and others, as we tone down ours in the spirit of the Golden Rule.

cantleave

Jando, Thanks for your support - much appreciated.

cantleave

Spike, I take your point - I was trying to put into words how I feel about some of the policies of the WTS. I do not see them as either friend or foe and do not have an axe to grind so my comments are purely descriptive of my observations.

Hi I hope i am welcome

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