I have many non believing friends and others who are religious. As long as we treat one another with kindness I couldn't care less about their faith or lack there of. I am busy with my own life and pursuits, my family and close friends. I did the religion thing years ago and it was a total waste of time. I also did the angry atheist thing....my new truth........and that was a waste of time. I started my own study and reading on all subjects and that worked out just fine. We raised our son in a religion free house and never mentioned god,Santa or Satan. We didn't read the bible. If he wanted to pursue a belief he could do so as an adult. If he wanted to visit a church as a teenager he could....not a problem. Since we didn't fill his head with childish nonsense he grew up in the real world and he turned out to be honest and kind and a great father and husband. He's not a 'worldly man' he's a natural man untroubled by the ramblings of people who lived and died 2,000 years ago. My sister (god love her......that's a change up pitch) once paid us the ultimate compliment when she said "I still don't understand how you raised such a wonderful son with no belief in god or the bible"..... I was going to tell her but it would only have started an argument. After I left the witnesses I wondered if we needed religion in our lives. There is a common denominator with all religions. A core of belief is developed and others hear about it and a movement is started and........ it grows. Soon after that it gets organized, develops rules and a structure .........then it becomes a business. Happens every time. Once I knew that I refused to join or take serious any movement be it atheist or religious.
Atheism 2.0
by Qcmbr 384 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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Terry
Hi there. Thanks for sharing this personal information about your family.
I decided somewhere along the line that the reason I got sucked in to Jehovah's Witnesses was because I was totally ignorant about the history
of religion and especially the bible. I was vulnerable to being manipulated. I had no rebuttal foundation.
So, after I was no longer JW I tried to cover with my kids what foundation there is to the history of the church, the oral transmission of Jesus stories, the Messiah expectations, the canon arguments, magesterium, sola scriptura. Not all in one evening, mind you :)
This way--if my kids were approached (and they were) they would at least have sufficient background enough to ask intelligent questions based on SOMETHING rather than nothing.
This worked like crazy.
Their religious friends had little or no answers or reasons for what they believed and began examining their own beliefs.
Ahhhh, sweeeet.
To know something is always better than to know nothing, imho.
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NewChapter
This is appropriate because the book is called RELIGION FOR ATHEISTS. Alain de Botton is a non-believer. Yet he argues religions have important things to teach the secular world. He's written a book explaining ways in which atheists should look to religion for some solutions to contemporary ills. In doing so, he hopes to move the tired old debate between atheists and believers onto more fruitful ground.
Blending deep respect with total impiety, de Botton proposes that agnostics and atheists should stop mocking religions and start stealing from them. For too long, he believes, we have faced a false choice between either swallowing doctrines or doing away with consoling and beautiful rituals and ideas.
You know, the Unitarian Universalists are already doing this. Congregation without doctrine. Believers, nonbelievers working together to be the best they can be. Coming together to reach common goals---organized to do good things. There is ritual for those who like, and community. Does he think he has come up with something new? I love going to UU, because the people are great. They know I don't believe, and they really don't care. It's easy to respect them individually, no matter what their individual belief, because they are so damned respectful and nonjudgemental. If it is structure you crave, give them a try. I was absolutely surprised. I missed community, and they offered it unconditionally.
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botchtowersociety
There is no such thing as "true for them". There is only true and not true.
Dude, that's like polar Watchtower thinking. It is fundamentalist thinking. Many things that matter in life aren't black/white.
" Luke, you're going to find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view. "
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tec
Yeah, I was going to suggest the UU also, NC. I've never been, but from all that others have shared here, then it doesn't matter what faith or no faith that you might be. I didn't think Q would be interested in that though, but perhaps.
Peace,
Tammy
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myelaine
dear NewChapter...
you said this in regard to the UU "church": " Coming together to reach common goals---organized to do good things"
while I can appreciate why many of you would leave the "notion" of God and "religion" behind, certainly in many cases here it is because of your mistreatment at the hands of the WTBTS. That organization is adept at instilling fear, guilt and low self esteem in otherwise healthy people. This type of tyranny is not found in most other christian denominations. Though you may have carry-over belief regarding what other christian denominations are like and teach...unless you walk with them for any length of time...you can't know that you might be wrong.
I would like to draw your attention to something that you might not have thought about in regard to the reason for organized religion and its ability to flourish. One underpinning of the scriptures is the notion of good verses evil...this is easily forgotten in the debate about what discipleship means (whatever "following" Jesus Christ represents). Notably though, by the "time" we get to the NT this struggle between good and evil involves the Prince of Peace and His opposition...
I believe that none of you would knowingly be against the notion of peace...
So, maybe you are against the idea of religion because it seems that it has some kind of "control" over you. Fair enough...you can't give any "entity" more control than you allow (obviously NOT talking about the WTBTS who take control)...there are a few exceptions to this principle however and the one I would like to talk about is involved in "protection" generally. In the forces you essentially sign over yourself to an entity to do with what they will...you yourself are put on the line as a defense against the opposition.
Now why not consider that those in the religious entity called the church are called upon in the same regard?...many of the same requirements are asked to be met in the "ideal" congregation...[knowledgeable] leaders, steadfast defenders [of the faith], [closing ranks] growing up to one "man"(to move closer together in a military formation. The soldiers closed ranks and marched on the enemy in tight formation.; to join with someone in a cause, or agreement. We can fight this menace only if we close ranks. Let's all close ranks with Ann and adopt her suggestions.)I'm sure you get the idea...:)...What if there is some purpose that has been overlooked?...What if this purpose has been obscured by the opposition by shifting the focus of the church as a defender of the weak to something that preys on the weak? ...wouldn't that serve the purpose of the opposition...take out the ONLY line of defense to more easily ravish the weak?...he can come in and take all of our treasures if there is no cohesive "force" to stop him...
That is why I believe that there are so many military references in the bible...all the way to the book of revelation, we hear about the "host". As much as we have grown up with the central ideas contained in the bible; call it the christian meme, we have lost the binding agent while we found american "freedom"...
There is a sworn "enemy" to this idea of freedom. It is called radical islam. As it is, the "west" is unprepared to counter this threat. A "nation" called islam that believes their allah is the supreme God and wants to impose its religion and laws on others is not going to be stopped by a group loosely comprised of athiests, agnostics, every other named "god" and a bunch of bickering christians...A battle like this is fought in the same "arena"... in the religious arena...the christian warrior IS armed to the teeth (ephesians 6:13-18) because we have God as our fortress and our ever present protector. I hope and pray that you would get yourselves together before it's too late...this enemy comes up from behind...it sneaks in the windows...it is a "religious" ideology therefore it IS metaphorically in the "heavenly" realm...^upstairs^ in the noggin' ...*sigh*...
You can't count on the "moderate" muslims in the west to stand toe to toe against their radical "brothers" given the situation they would have to side with the radicals or lose thier lives. this is your opposition...this is how it is:...job 41:15-17...individually we can do nothing BUT, as a "nation" named and blessed to flourish by God, we can be defenders of the weak...including our moderate muslim "brothers in the flesh"...
love michelle
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cofty
That organization is adept at instilling fear, guilt and low self esteem in otherwise healthy people. This type of tyranny is not found in most other christian denominations.
All religions who call themselves christian begin with the disgraceful premise that we are sinners, enemies of god and worthy only of his wrath, that all our good deeds are filthy rags, and that it took human blood sacrifice to assuage the wrath of god with whom we have an accounting. That every second of the day god knows everything we do and even our most secret thoughts for which we will be judged.
It is the ultimate tyranny - a celestial North Korea.
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NewChapter
certainly in many cases here it is because of your mistreatment at the hands of the WTBTS.
Actually no. I am one of those rare people that did not feel mistreated by the WTBTS while I was in. I was a true believer. Yet while researching for a story, I looked into some things---and blew my freaking mind. I was not looking to disprove my god notion, actually I thought I was going to strengthen it as my story was about Noah's flood. My eyes were opened, and I took the first non-biased look at the god concept. I did not read Dawkins. I did not read this site. I read about science and came to my own conclusion. I am not angry, but I REALLY, REALLY resent the assumption that I must be hurting, or broken in some way to choose atheism. Nothing could be further from the truth.
This type of tyranny is not found in most other christian denominations
Doesn't matter. I see their beliefs based on faulty premises, and no matter how wonderful they are, I will not believe. I am not mad at god. I am not mad at faeries or unicorns. Do you see? Not to be insulting to those who believe in a god, but FOR ME, he is as real as other mythical creatures.
So, maybe you are against the idea of religion because it seems that it has some kind of "control" over you.
AGAIN, No. I reject the concept of a god.
Look, if you are going to be so very far offbase, and so completely in the dark about how many of us think, perhaps you should stop theorizing and just ask us. And then believe us. We are not the walking wounded. We are not unhappy or in need of filling a void. Stop presuming. Okay?
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myelaine
dear cofty...
you said: "All religions who call themselves christian begin with the disgraceful premise that we are sinners, enemies of god and worthy only of his wrath, that all our good deeds are filthy rags, and that it took human blood sacrifice to assuage the wrath of god with whom we have an accounting"...
do you want me to apologise for rallying around the One who felt I was worth taking the wrath for?
love michelle
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myelaine
dear NewChapter...
I said many here were hurt...which is true.
I actually only used your statement as a jumping off point for my post...I was speaking to the general audience not only to you specifically.
...but thank you for your prompt rebuttal, I think...
love michelle
