Oklahoma beheading - Islam is a disease

by Simon 1524 Replies latest members adult

• 

  poopsiecakes

  Mikado and Jeffro, what's your opinion of women wearing the hijab? Have you ever had a conversation with one of them and tried to understand why they wear it? Have you ever spoken with a woman who is so afraid of her father that she will devote her life to a marriage or career that she has no personal interest in and tried to understand why? Have you ever had a conversation with someone while they're observing Ramadan and talked about why they do it and what they pray for?

  I would never call for the banning of any religion, that creates martyrs and underground fanatics. My hope is that slowly but surely people wake up to the insidious and pervasive power that their beliefs engender and how close they are to stepping over the line to fanatisism by simply adhereing to the tenets of their faith. That goes for JW's, Mormans, Baptists, Amish, Mennonites, 7th Day Adventists, Catholics, Jews, and Muslims in no particular order.
• 

  Mikado

  some of my friends wear it, many don't, its their choice totally, and I support it totally

  i spend time with them whilst they are observing Ramadan.

  there a lots of things I don't support about islam, but according to Simon all the Muslims I know aren't true Muslims? all the muslims I know are good decent honest honourable people who do not support Isis and the like...
• 

  SanLuisObispoTruthSeeker

  Said Allah hates those who don't accept Islam.
  (Qur'an 30:45, 3:32, 22:38)

  "I have been commanded to fight
  against people till they testify that there
  is no god but Allah, and that Muhammad
  is the messenger of Allah"(Muslim 1:33)

  Ayatollah Khomeini:

  quote-of-the-day-khomeini-spits-on-those-who-say-islam-is-peaceful

  Islam makes it incumbent on all adult males, provided they are not disabled or incapacitated, to prepare themselves for the conquest of [other] countries so that the writ of Islam is obeyed in every country in the world. . . . But those who study Islamic Holy War will understand why Islam wants to conquer the whole world. . . . Those who know nothing of Islam pretend that Islam counsels against war. Those [who say this] are witless. Islam says: Kill all the unbelievers just as they would kill you all! Does this mean that Muslims should sit back until they are devoured by [the unbelievers]? Islam says: Kill them [the non-Muslims], put them to the sword and scatter [their armies]. Does this mean sitting back until [non-Muslims] overcome us? Islam says: Kill in the service of Allah those who may want to kill you! Does this mean that we should surrender [to the enemy]? Islam says: Whatever good there is exists thanks to the sword and in the shadow of the sword! People cannot be made obedient except with the sword! The sword is the key to Paradise, which can be opened only for the Holy Warriors! There are hundreds of other [Qur'anic] psalms and Hadiths [sayings of the Prophet] urging Muslims to value war and to fight. Does all this mean that Islam is a religion that prevents men from waging war? I spit upon those foolish souls who make such a claim.

  You infidels at this site cannot defeat us. We are 1.2 billion. We will double again. Do you have enough bullets to kill us?

  On the camera:

  - We will always say, Islam is the religion of Peace.
  - We will say,Jihad is actually inner Jihad.
  - Moderate Muslim will say there is no link between Islam and Terrorism and the
  West will believe it because the West is so gullible.
  - Moderate Muslim all over the world will incubate Jihadist by their talk by defending Islam.
  - Using Western Legal system we will assert our Sharia Laws, slowly but surely.
  - We will increase in number. We will double again.

  You will be impressed when you meet a moderate Muslim personally. As your next-door neighbor, coworker, student, teacher, engineer, professionals you may even like us. You will find us well mannered, polite, humble that will make you say,wow, Muslims are good and peaceful people, But, we will stab you in your back when you are sleeping as we did on 911.

  There will be more 911 in Europe and in America. We will say,We do not support terrorism but America got what it deserved.

  Muslims, CAIR, ISNA, MPAC and other international Islamic Organization will unite. We will partner with Leftist, ACLU, with Koffi Annan, and the UN, and if we have to then even with France. Fasten your seatbelt. The war of civilizations has just begun.

  We will recite Quran and say Allah-Hu-Akbar before beheading infidels, as we have been doing it. We will video tape those and send it to all infidels to watch. They will surrender – ISLAM means surrender.

  We will use your own values of kindness against you.

  You are destined to loose.

  http://www.ironicsurrealism.com/2013/06/04/former-muslim-who-left-sick-and-evil-religion-of-islam-warns-the-west-islam-means-surrender/

  Top Ten Quran Verses for Understanding ISIS (the Islamic State)

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXBgqa-xQwY
• 

  Frazzled UBM

  I can see you have all been whipping yourselves up into a frenzy of anti-Islam vitriol over the weekend by focussing on those passages in the Quran and those claiming to speak on behalf of Islam that support your viewpoint. The confirmation bias is strong and few posters seem willing to swim against the tide.

  Well done - the problem as far as I see it is Fanatacism - this is what is causing young Muslims, including young Muslims in the West, to identify with and join Extremist groups.

  The attraction of fanaticism is not unlike the attraction of cults like the Witnesses - absolute certainty in the correctness of your Black and White view of the world such that you feel morally justified in committing atrocious acts (in the case3 of Witnesses shunning of family members - not on the same scale of atrocity as beheading but you get the idea). So what is it that causes young people to be attracted to fanaticism? In the 70s in Germany to be attracted to the likes of Barder Mienhoff or in the 70s and 80s in the Falls Road in Belfast to be attracted to the IRA or now in Gaza to be attracted to Hamas - it is alienation and disillusionment.

  Why would young Muslims in the West be disillusioned? You only have to look at this thread to understand the depth of hostility that currently exists in the West towards Islam and Muslims - the fact that young Muslims in the UK and US are attracted by Extremist versions of Islam when they are made to feel unwanted even despised and their faith is condemned and insulted. If like myelaine you are concerned about the threat of young Muslims in the West becoming fanatics then my advice to you is to get to know young Muslims and make them feel part of the community and that their faith is tolerated. This problem of the radicalization of young Muslims is not the fault of Islam or the parents - it is the fault of Western Society and its demonisation fo Islam and vilification of ordinary decent Muslims. This thread is a symptom of the problem.
• 

  barry

  Andrew Bolt wrote an artical in the newspaper today entitled IS is Islams cross to bear.

  In the artical he refers to the political correct saying Islam has Islamic state and Christianity has Hitler. This statement he dissagrees with and he also says he is not a Christian.

  Fact one the Islamic state claims it is Islamic but the National Socialists never claimed they were Christian

  Fact two the Islamic state quotes Islams sacred texts in the Koran and Hadith to legitimise its slaughters but the Nazis never quoted the Bible to legitimise its genocide. Islamic state recent statement ordered Muslims around the world and specifically in Australia quoted the Koran and Hadith at least 25 times to kill the disbeliever whether is a civilian or military. Just two weeks ago and 18 ear old terrorist attempted just that and stabbed two policemen and was shot in the head by one of the wounded policemen. The terrorist had two knives and an Islamic flag in his pocket.

  Fact three the Islamic state is not cjompletely delusional in claiming it has a religious mandate. Mohammed practiced war and violence in a way Jesus never did. Teh texts of the respective faiths show the difference. The Koran and Hadith urge and condone violence against enemies while the Christian new Testament does not. 'Allah the exaulted said,And when the sacred months have passed then kill the polytheists wherever you find them and capture them and besiege them and sit in wait for them at every place of ambush and He the exalted said 'So when you meet those who disbelieve strike their necks'.

  Nowhere is Christ recorded urging followers to kill disbelievers . Christianity would be a very different faith had he done so. Instead Christ urged his followers to reach out to unbelievers not with a sword but with help even to an enemy. When besieged by enemies Christ did not fight back but lhe let himself be killed.

  Fact Four the Islamic state insists it fulfils Islams purpose on Earth but Hitler believed Nazism should destroy Christianity. Hitler like the Islamic State and many other totalitarians was an enemy of Christianity not least because it defends the dignity of every indivital the unborn the lame and resists their enslavement or destruction. In private conversations later published in Hitlers table talk the Nazie leader argued national socialism and religion cannot exist together.

  For commentators today to blithely assert the connection between Islam and the Islamic State is no stronger or weaker than that between Christianity and Nazism is to make virtue out of a dangerous ignorance.

  Worse it is to slander the foundation and great guardian of our tolerance and freedom.
• 

  Frazzled UBM

  Nice strawman argument Barry, or actually Andrew Bolt, who is a renouned outspoken Australian radical conservative and was just parroting the popular US radical conservative line that Islam is responsible for IS. A little while ago the idiot Australian PM Abbott, inspired by the radical conservatives, challenged mainstream Muslims in Australia to do more to counter Extremism - in a stinging rebuke Muslim leaders wrote cataloguing all that they ahd been doing that Abbott was blissfully unaware of. Abbott apologised with his tail between his legs.
• 

  Mikado

  anyone who quotes that well known nut, Andrew bolt, has no credibility.
• 

  Frazzled UBM

  So Barry you are a Christian Triumphalist. "Their are many other examples that show how different Christianity is to Islam and Judiaism also Christianity was a religion oppressed by the authorities but Islam and Judiaism were both state religions." (BTW Christianity eventually became the offical religion of the Roman Empire and would not be the religion it is today but for that) Quoting selective passages from either religion as you do to say "this one is this and that one is that" is like a blind man grapping the tail of an elephant and saying an elephant is shaped like a snake. Simon is also using this tactic and challenged me on Friday to deny that there are passages in the Quran promoting violence. I have not done that because there are - as there are in the OT but saying that because there are such passages that is what the religion is all about denies all the other passages to the contrary and the itjihad tradition that focusses on the Humanist elements and says you should not read the Quran literally - I have already made this point but it seems the literalists like Simon and LUHE don't want to hear it.
• 

  LoveUniHateExams

  @Frazzled

  'it is alienation and disillusionment' - the problem is though, that devout muslims often alienate themselves and might not be too good at integrating into the host culture.

  I agree with you that gratuitous abuse or ridiculing of belief is wrong and unhelpful in that it lacks consideration of others.

  Also, why do you refer to jihad as 'itjihad'? Does this prefix represent the definite article (e.g. al-dawlat, ar-Raqqa, Allah = al + ilah, etc)?

  Thank you.
• 

  barry

  Before 9/11 I muslim friend of mine suggested I travel to the middle east and teach people their to fly aeroplanes. The same moderate muslim guy living here in Australia with all the rights and priviliges we all share told me if Islam were to take over Australia I woiuld be slaughtered if I didn't convert and he added if Islam had nuclear bombs they would be used against us and to clean up the rest of the infidels in the world. My friend also added he used to be fanatic but is now moderate. My friends brother who is president of the multicultural society in Canberra told us he has changed his thinking about genocide of non muslims because there is to many of us to kill.

  I guess being accepting of other cultures has just turned me into a biggot and its all my fault because i'm just to gullible and believe all their lies. Please forgive me! I suppose if anyone quotes me they have no credibility.

  There are some genuine non violent muslim activists that do want change and a chance to avoid a literal translation of the Koranic texts which we should support. Many of them are marginalised.

  I would also agree the OT bible has some very violent texts but I would suggest these texts are seen as abrogated by the new testiment just as with the older Koranic texts are abrogated. I would challenge anyone here to show clear evidence for violence in the new testiment and the teaching of Jesus.