Flee to the Mountains......What Mountains?

by liam 17 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  Vidqun

  Vanderhoven, you jiggle the vocabulary just like the Watchtower. I cannot see how you reach the conclusion that Jesus is talking about a localized tribulation in the Middle East: "for then there will be great tribulation such as has not occurred since the world's beginning until now, no, nor will occur again. In fact, unless those days were cut short, no flesh would be saved; but on account of the chosen ones those days will be cut short." (Matt. 24:21, 22; Mark 13:19, 20; cf. Dan. 12:1). Is Jesus lying or embellishing and overstating the facts?

  Not all of us have mountains close by to flee to. Perhaps the mountains are figurative. The prophet Zechariah mentions some figurative mountains to flee to: “And Jehovah will certainly go forth and war against those nations as in the day of his warring, in the day of fight. And his feet will actually stand in that day upon the mountain of the olive trees, which is in front of Jerusalem, on the east; and the mountain of the olive trees must be split at its middle, from the sunrising and to the west. There will be a very great valley; and half of the mountain will actually be moved to the north, and half of it to the south. And YOU people will certainly flee to the valley of my mountains; because the valley of [the] mountains will reach all the way to Azel. And YOU will have to flee, just as YOU fled because of the [earth]quake in the days of Uzziah the king of Judah.” (Zech. 14:3-7).

  Same goes for Isaiah and Micah: "And many peoples will certainly go and say, Come, YOU people, and let us go up to the mountain of Jehovah, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will instruct us about his ways, and we will walk in his paths. For out of Zion law will go forth, and the word of Jehovah out of Jerusalem." (Isa. 2:2, 3; cf. Mic. 4:1, 2)
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  HereIam60

  Since there was no Biblical support for this "further instructions revealed to, and by qualified men" stuff. They've resorted to partially quoting 'Church Father' Eusebius. If you look up past mentions of Eusebius in Watchtower publications, you find he was described as someone who did not stand firm in his faith and compromised with Constantine the great. Also they've only used a portion of his writing that seems to confirm their own idea. As said by someone else, no scholars among them, and the "leaders" no longer even seem spiritually minded.
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  raymond frantz

  Here is the full text from Eusebius "Ecclesiastical History" book III ,chapter 5, paragraph 3, thank me later😀

  "But the people of the church in Jerusalem had been commanded by a revelation, vouchsafed to approved men there before the war, to leave the city and to dwell in a certain town of Perea called Pella. And when those that believed in Christ had come there from Jerusalem, then, as if the royal city of the Jews and the whole land of Judea were entirely destitute of holy men, the judgment of God at length overtook those who had committed such outrages against Christ and his apostles, and totally destroyed that generation of impious men."
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  BoogerMan

  A) Note what Jesus said about the imminent and only tribulation to which he was warning his Jewish listeners - "For then there will be great distress, unequaled from the beginning of the world until now, and never to be equaled again," and

  B) consider the context of the elder's reference to "the great tribulation" at Revelation 7:14; he was reminding John of the same great tribulation which the angel had warned about just a few minutes earlier, @ Revelation 2:22.

  You can't have a "greater" fulfillment of something which will never be repeated!
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  Earnest

  Note that the authenticity of Eusebius's account has been debated amongst historians because

  (a) he wrote his Ecclesiastical History over 200 years after the events;

  (b) there is no corroborating evidence from contemporary sources including Josephus;

  (c) a pagan city seems an unlikely place for refuge in a time of Roman hostility to Jews;

  (d) the narrative fits too neatly with Christian theological interpretations of Jerusalem's destruction, comparing it to the fall of Sodom and the escape of Lot and his daughters.

  The article The Jewish Christians' Move from Jerusalem as a Pragmatic Choice by Jonathan Bourgel in Studies in Rabbinic Judaism and Early Christianity – Text and Context, 2010, gives more substance to these arguments.
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  nowwhat?

  Nothing new, Here in America Busch beer has been telling us to "head to the mountains..." For years!
• 

  DesirousOfChange

  From what I saw/heard is that everything the WTS/GB said during that time is to do all the CDC and WHO said to do. Stay home, wear mask, take vax shot, etc.

  They didn't want to risk losing any stimulus money from the Gov't nor take the risk of any retribution coming their way from the Gov't. In OTHER countries, that's OK. But not here where they might personally be held accountable.
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  raymond frantz

  @Earnest

  I'd rather believe Eusebius who lived 200 years after the events rather than a Jewish "historian" who lived 2000 years later with bias who questions everything. By the way Eusebius is not the only one of that period to write about the Christian Exodus.

  ​In his work Panarion, Epiphanius of Salamis discusses the flight of early Christians from Jerusalem to Pella prior to the city's destruction. In section 29.7.7-8, he writes:​

  "This sect of the Nazoraeans is to be found in Beroea near Coele Syria, in the Decapolis near the region of Pella, and in Bashanitis at the place called Kokabe—meaning 'Star,' but 'Kochabe' in Hebrew. For it was from there that this sect began after the exodus from Jerusalem, when all the disciples went to live in Pella, because Christ had told them to leave Jerusalem and to emigrate since it would undergo a siege. Because of this advice they lived in Perea after moving to that place, as I said."