Remember this is warfare to them... and Love to you! All is fair in love and war so your covered on both counts!!!
My wife is getting baptized on the 19th!
by Check_Your_Premises 111 Replies latest jw experiences
-
-
Check_Your_Premises
It is imperative to get legal help if she is getting baptized to protect yourself and children in a medical emergency. You must not leave this in her hands.
What am I supposed to get legal advice about?
-
ChristianObserver
CYP - Although the first quote primarily concerns witnessing to children in other households, you might be able to use this sentence to your advantage and maintain that you feel that your headship has been undermined by the witnessing that has been carried out to date within your household. This could act as a delaying tactic if you explain that you wish to be sure of all things too! Remind the elders that as head of the household, you have various responsibilities towards your wife as well as your children as outlined in their publications as follows:
*** be study 31 p. 191 Respect Shown to Others ***Respect also involves acknowledging headship. In some places it is necessary to speak to the head of the house before witnessing to others in the household. Although our commission to preach and teach comes from Jehovah, we recognize that parents are the ones authorized by God to train, discipline, and direct their children. (Eph. 6:1-4) Hence, when calling at a home, it is usually appropriate to speak first to the parents before engaging children in any extended discussion.
Insight on the Scriptures Volume 1 pp. 814-815 Father FATHER
The Hebrew word ´av, translated "father," is a mimetic (imitative) word taken from the first and simplest sounds of infant lips. The Hebrew ´av and the Greek pa·ter´ are both used in various senses: as begetter, or progenitor, of an individual (Pr 23:22; Zec 13:3; Lu 1:67), the head of a household or ancestral family (Ge 24:40; Ex 6:14), an ancestor (Ge 28:13; Joh 8:53), a founder of a nation (Mt 3:9), a founder of a class or profession (Ge 4:20, 21), a protector (Job 29:16; Ps 68:5), the source of something (Job 38:28), and a term of respect (2Ki 5:13; Ac 7:2).
Jehovah God as Creator is called Father. (Isa 64:8; compare Ac 17:28, 29.) He is also the Father of spirit-begotten Christians, the Aramaic term ´Ab·ba´´ being used as an expression of respect and of close filial relationship. (Ro 8:15; see ABBA.) All who express faith with a hope of everlasting life can address God as Father. (Mt 6:9) Jesus Christ, the Messiah, because of being God?s Chief Agent of life, was prophetically called Eternal Father. (Isa 9:6) Also, anyone who has imitators and followers, or those who exhibit his qualities, is regarded as a father to them. (Mt 5:44, 45; Ro 4:11, 12) In this sense the Devil is spoken of as a father.?Joh 8:44; compare Ge 3:15.
Applying "father" to men as a formalistic or religious title was forbidden by Jesus. (Mt 23:9) Because of Paul?s bringing the good news to certain Christians and nourishing them spiritually he was like a father to them, but in no scripture is "father" applied to him as a religious title. (1Co 4:14, 15) Paul likened himself to both a father and a mother in his relation to the Thessalonian Christians. (1Th 2:7, 11) Whereas reference is made at Luke 16:24, 30 to "father Abraham," this is basically in the sense of fleshly ancestry.
Father?s
Authority and Responsibilities. As described in the Bible, the father was the head of the household, being guardian, protector, the one making final decisions, and the judge of the family group. (1Co 11:3; Ge 31:32) Among the patriarchs and in Israel before the selection of the Levitical priesthood, the father took the lead in representing his family in worship as a priest. (Ge 12:8; Job 1:5; Ex 19:22) The father had authority over his household until his death. If the son married and set up an independent household, then he became head over it, although due respect was still shown toward the father. When a daughter married, she came under the headship of her husband. (Nu 30:3-8) In Bible times the father usually arranged for the marriage of his children. If he came into dire financial straits, he could sell his daughter into slavery, with certain restrictions for her protection.?Ex 21:7.Fatherly
Concern for the Family Members. As God?s representative, the father is responsible to see that God?s principles are taught to his household. (Ge 18:19; Eph 6:4; De 6:6, 7) His teaching and disciplinary duties also include personal instructions and commands, which the mother assists in carrying out. (Pr 1:8; 6:20) The God-fearing father has great love for his children and exhorts and consoles them with great tenderness. (1Th 2:11; Ho 11:3) So that they might walk in the right way, he disciplines, corrects, and reproves them. (Heb 12:9; Pr 3:12) He finds pleasure in his sons, and especially does he rejoice when they display wisdom. (Pr 10:1) On the other hand, he is deeply grieved and vexed by a course of stupidity on the part of his children. (Pr 17:21, 25) He is to be compassionate and merciful. (Mal 3:17; Ps 103:13) He is to be considerate of their needs and requests. (Mt 7:9-11) A pattern for human fathers is provided in the many descriptions of God?s love and care for his people.***
it-1 p. 807 Family ***Structure
and Conservation of Family. In ancient Hebrew society the family was the basic unit. The family was a small government; the father as head was responsible to God, and the mother was the subordinate manager over the children in the household. (Ac 2:29; Heb 7:4) The family was, in a small way, a reflection of the grand family of God. God is represented in the Bible as a husband, with the "Jerusalem above" as the mother of his children.?Ga 4:26; compare Isa 54:5.*** it-1 pp. 682-683 Education ***
In
Patriarchal Society. Throughout the entire Bible the family is the basic unit for imparting education. In earliest society the father was the head of the family and of the household, which might even be a large community, such as that of Abraham. The family head was responsible for the education of his household. (Ge 18:19)***
w88 11/1 pp. 20-25 When Marital Peace Is Threatened ***When
Marital Peace Is Threatened"A wife should not depart from her husband; . . . and a husband should not leave his wife."?1 CORINTHIANS 7:10, 11.
JEHOVAH GOD united the first human pair in wedlock and purposed that this one-flesh bond should last. It was to be a blessed union that would result in their happiness and in the producing of righteous offspring, all to God?s glory.?Genesis 1:27, 28; 2:24.
8
Stress is laid on preserving a marriage even if only one mate is a believer. Paul wrote: "If any brother has an unbelieving wife, and yet she is agreeable to dwelling with him, let him not leave her; and a woman who has an unbelieving husband, and yet he is agreeable to dwelling with her, let her not leave her husband. . . . But if the unbelieving one proceeds to depart, let him depart; a brother or a sister is not in servitude under such circumstances, but God has called you to peace. For, wife, how do you know but that you will save your husband? Or, husband, how do you know but that you will save your wife?" (1 Corinthians 7:12-16) If the unbeliever chooses to depart, the Christian will let him go. But the believer, hoping that the unbeliever may be won over to Christianity, will not initiate the breakup. Timothy?s mother, Eunice, apparently stayed with her unbelieving husband but imparted spiritual instruction to her son.?2 Timothy 1:5; 3:14, 15.Grounds
for Separation9
Paul?s words at 1 Corinthians 7:10-16 encourage marriage mates to stay together. Yet, some, after trying very hard to preserve their marriage relationship, have finally decided that, in all conscience, they have no choice but to separate. What may be the grounds for such a step?10
Willful nonsupport is one basis for separation....11 Extreme physical abuse is another basis for separation. ...
12 Absolute endangerment of spirituality also provides a basis for separation. The believer in a religiously divided home should do everything possible to take advantage of God?s spiritual provisions. But separation is allowable if an unbelieving mate?s opposition (perhaps including physical restraint) makes it genuinely impossible to pursue true worship and actually imperils the believer?s spirituality. Yet, what if a very unhealthy spiritual state exists where both mates are believers? The elders should render assistance, but especially should the baptized husband work diligently to remedy the situation. Of course, if a baptized marriage partner acts like an apostate and tries to prevent his mate from serving Jehovah, the elders should handle matters according to the Scriptures. If disfellowshipping takes place in a case involving absolute endangerment of spirituality, willful nonsupport, or extreme physical abuse, the faithful Christian who seeks a legal separation would not be going against Paul?s counsel about taking a believer to court.?1 Corinthians 6:1-8.
Work
to Resolve Problems17
Displaying wisdom in connection with material things can contribute to marital peace. To illustrate: After considering his wife?s negative viewpoint, a man may decide, nevertheless, that it is wise for his family to move elsewhere. This may seem advisable for economic reasons, but it may also enable the family to advance Kingdom interests by serving where the need is greater. (Matthew 6:33) His Christian wife may not favor the move because she would be leaving behind her parents or familiar surroundings. But she will be wise to cooperate fully with her husband, who is the head of the household and has the responsibility of determining where his family will live. Moreover, her submissiveness and loving cooperation will contribute to domestic peace.?Ephesians 5:21-24.19
Properly exercised headship will strengthen marital ties. Of course, the mature Christian husband will not be a dictator. Rather, ?he will keep on loving his wife and will not be bitterly angry with her.? Jehovah expects him to exercise loving headship. (Colossians 3:18, 19) In turn, such headship promotes family peace.In
Divided Households20
Being reasonable aids in resolving marital problems between Christian mates. (Philippians 4:5) But reasonableness is also important if peace is threatened in a religiously divided household. If an unbelieving husband tries to prevent his Christian wife from serving Jehovah, she may endeavor to reason with him, tactfully pointing out that she accords him religious freedom and she should logically receive similar treatment. (Matthew 7:12) Though she is to be in relative subjection to her unbelieving husband, God?s will must be done where there is a conflict. (1 Corinthians 11:3; Acts 5:29) Surely, attending Christian meetings three times a week is not excessive. But the believing wife may find it wise to be at home on other evenings and to schedule much of her field ministry during hours when her husband is working and the children are in school. With reasonableness and good planning, she need not "give up in doing what is fine."?Galatians 6:9.21
Reasonableness extends to other matters too. For example, a person has a right to practice a certain religion. But it would be reasonable and wise for a Christian wife not to place her Bibles and Bible study aids where a strongly opposed husband might object. Conflict may be avoided if such publications are kept among her personal effects and she studies them privately. Of course, she must not compromise on righteous principles.?Matthew 10:16.22
If disruption of domestic peace centers on religious instruction of the children, the believing wife can tactfully arrange to have them accompany her to meetings and in the field ministry. But if the unbelieving husband and father prevents this, she can teach the children Bible principles so that when they grow up and leave home, they are likely to pursue true worship.Maintain Peace as a United Family
23
Since marriage partners are "one flesh," they should live together in peace according to God?s arrangement for married people, especially if both mates are Christians. (Matthew 19:5; 1 Corinthians 7:3-5) But if marital peace is threatened in your case, prayerfully review the foregoing Scriptural points. It may also be helpful to think back to the time of your courtship. How hard both of you tried to do what was right and lay the basis for a happy union! Will you now make similar efforts to hold your marriage together? [Study Questions]19. Headship of what kind will promote family peace?
20, 21. How may reasonableness prove beneficial when peace is threatened in a religiously divided household?
22. What might be done if disruption of domestic peace centers on the religious instruction of the children?
23. If marital peace is threatened, what may prove helpful?
*** w80 11/15 p. 29 By What System Is Your Family Governed? ***Are we to conclude that absolute authority is vested in the hands of the husband and that he can do just what he likes? No, that is not what the Bible teaches. It does say that the husband is head of the household. (Eph. 5:22, 23)
*** w80 11/15 p. 29 By What System Is Your Family Governed? ***
In modern society, subjection is distasteful to many women, but a balanced view can change this. The one in authority has greater responsibility, and consequently more problems, than the one in subjection.
*** w67 2/1 pp. 67-68 Men Who Really Are Head of the House ***Men Who Really Are Head of the House"A HUSBAND is head of his wife," the Bible explains. (Eph. 5:23) Yet, according to reports of social scientists and wives themselves, many modern-day husbands have abdicated their rightful position as head of the house.
The failure of many men to exercise proper headship is clearly responsible for a large portion of today?s marital problems. What, therefore, is involved in being a proper head of the house? What role should the husband assume in the family? How should he treat his wife?
Some men interpret headship to mean that they should be dictators to their wives. In fact, it has long been the practice in some places for husbands to treat their wives as slaves or worse. But this is not in harmony with the above Scriptural principle, for notice that it says: "A husband is head of his wife as the Christ also is head of the congregation." And Christ definitely did not treat his congregation of followers in an unloving manner!
So men who really are the head of the house are not dictatorial bosses. Yet, on the other hand, neither are they weak and irresolute, allowing their wives to assume the role that is rightfully theirs. A proper head is, as Webster?s New Third International Dictionary describes, "one who stands in relation to others somewhat as the head does to other members of the body . . . one in charge of a division or department." Thus, as the physical head directs the movements and operations of the body, or the head one of a department supervises the organization and work of his staff, so the head of the house should assume charge of the household, having jurisdiction over its activities.
The situation is similar in a home. If a man turns over leadership and all decision-making to his wife, she quickly loses respect for him as her head. A man that says, "Go ask your mother," whenever the children ask permission to do something; or, "You decide," whenever a family decision has to be made, reveals that he is not really the head of the house. And such a home is generally an unhappy one.
What, then, does proper headship involve? Does it mean making all decisions? Does it include directing every activity and movement of one?s wife and children? Not at all! God created humans, including wives and children, to enjoy relative freedom. People are discontent and rebel when their every move and moment of time is directed and scheduled for them.
So proper headship is not a matter of making every decision, but of exercising oversight of all the activities and business of one?s family. It is the man?s responsibility to set the guidelines according to which the household is run. Yet, at the same time, there can be a great latitude of freedom within the bounds set.
*** w01 11/15 p. 31 Noah?s Faith Condemns the World ***As the family head, Noah gladly devoted time and loving attention to his household. This included caring for the spiritual interests of his wife, his three sons, and his daughters-in-law.
CYP - Could you ask to be afforded the same courtesy?
Does your wife know the following? If her parents or siblings are not JW, she might feel unable to attend their funeral service...
*** w70 3/15 pp. 191-192 Questions from Readers ***? May dedicated Christians attend church funerals of other religious organizations??C. S., U.S.A.Some Christians may feel obligated to attend a church funeral because of a debt of gratitude, because a close relative is involved or due to pressures from an unbelieving mate. But before doing so each one should consider the various factors involved and the possible alternatives. While doing so is not forbidden by the Christian congregation, such a course is certainly fraught with dangers and problems.
First of all, it is well to remember that a church funeral is not held primarily to afford friends an opportunity to console the bereaved family. Usually that is done in the funeral parlor beforehand or by visiting the family in their home. The church funeral is really a religious service. It therefore is likely to involve a sermon advocating such unscriptural ideas as the immortality of the soul and that all good people go to heaven. It may also involve unscriptural practices such as making the sign of the cross and most likely the joining in united prayer with a priest or minister of another religion. Of course, a Christian could not take part in such, in view of the command at Revelation 18:4.
Some dedicated Christians have attended church funerals because they wanted to stay close to the immediate family and support them. So they went to the funeral parlor, to the church funeral and then even to the grave. They might have been able to do all that without personally committing any false religious act. There are, of course, spiritual hazards in going to any place of false worship.
True, a Christian wife whose husband is an unbeliever and who wants her to attend a church funeral might look to the example of Naaman. He was the Syrian general who was cured of leprosy by bathing himself seven times in the Jordan River at the command of the prophet Elisha. Because of this miraculous cure Naaman was determined never to worship any other god than Jehovah. But that would be a hard thing for him to do because he was still in the service of his king. He helped the king get around and so would have to go with him into the house of the pagan god Rimmon. He might even have to help the king bow down. So he asked that Jehovah God forgive him and not hold this against him. Naaman, who had become a true worshiper of Jehovah, was not himself worshiping this false god; he was only there under orders.?2 Ki. 5:1-19.
And so with the Christian wife who has an unbelieving husband. If her husband insisted that on a certain occasion she go with him to a church funeral of a relative or family friend she might feel that she could act in a way similar to that in which Naaman did?be present on that occasion but not share in any acts of false religion. But whether she went would be up to her to decide. She would have to resolve the conflict between respect for her husband?s wishes and obedience to Jehovah and the dictates of her conscience, trained by God?s Word.?1 Pet. 3:16.
Yes, her conscience would be involved. Why? Because others might see her, one of Jehovah?s witnesses, entering the church, and they might be stumbled. She would therefore have to consider that possibility. As the apostle Paul wrote: "Make sure of the more important things, so that you may be flawless and not be stumbling others up to the day of Christ."?Phil. 1:10.
Better it would be if such a wife tried to explain her position to her husband. She would do well to pick a time when he was relaxed and in a good frame of mind, taking a lesson from Queen Esther, and then tactfully try to explain why she felt she could not attend such a church funeral. Among other things, she could point out that if she attended and did not take part in the ritual it might be very embarrassing to others, and especially to her husband. So an unbelieving husband might agree, out of love for his wife, respect for her religious scruples and a desire to avoid embarrassment.?Esther 5:1-8.
But might one offend the bereaved family by not attending? Only if one ignored the death entirely. One would not need to do that. A person could do things to show that he was sympathetic and interested in helping. He could go to the funeral parlor beforehand, express condolences to the family and offer practical help. A person could bring over food if need be, or cook a meal there for the family, or watch the children, relieving the adults of that responsibility temporarily. Then the family would not think that the person was unloving just because he did not attend the church funeral.
Thus there is no need for a Christian to feel obligated to go to a church funeral of another religious organization, where there may be the temptation to give in to pressure and follow the crowd when everyone else is performing some false religious act. Thus also the danger of performing an act of apostasy and displeasing Jehovah God can be avoided. But each one must decide for oneself on the basis of circumstances and one?s own conscience.
CYP - I hope these give some insight into the teachings of this group and an idea of what your wife might be embracing.
-
jgnat
What am I supposed to get legal advice about?
Get an advanced medical directive written for each member of your family and filed with your family doctor. Outline that everybody is to have blood transfusions (except perhaps, your wife). Get you and your wife to sign as joint guardians.
That way, you can perhaps prevent the accidental death of your children in an emergency.
-
144001
"What am I supposed to get legal advice about?"
For starters, I'd get advice on the very real possibility that your marriage will be ending, sooner than you might suspect. Your wife is already answering to the Watchtower, so you can safely assume that the day will come when she will choose the Watchtower over you. I know it's hard for you to believe it will come to that, but I'd give you 80% or greater odds that you're heading for divorce. Mixed marriages with JWs rarely work.
As part of that consultation, you should inquire about the laws of your state regarding custody of your children. The Watchtower may actually provide legal assistance to your wife, at no cost to her, to steal your children away from you and force them to endure the misery and exploitation that comes with being a child of a Jehovah's Witness. You can not even fathom how horrible it is to be a child in the Jehovah's Witness cult. It will definitely result in the infliction of severe emotional distress on your children, and after your irresponsible wife twiddles her thumbs and blames other factors for the psychological damage to your kids, you will be left to pick up the pieces. If you want your children to grow up healthy, you must keep them away from this abusive cult. It will positively damage them.
Others have mentioned the blood transfusion issue. In California and many other states, a parent cannot stop a doctor from administering a life-saving blood transfusion to a minor. Find out what the laws are in your state.
Your situation with your wife is a lot more serious than I think you realize. Don't underestimate this situation, it has the potential to destroy your relationship as well as the lives of your children. The Jehovah's Witness cult is threatening your family, don't just lie there and let them victimize you. Step up to the plate and fight the Watchtower cult aggressively! Kick their f'ing ass! -
4JWY
144,001 -
AMEN!!
-
Honesty
However, you do have the upper hand in the fact that you're 'the man' and, therefore, head of the household. At your request, she has to decorate, cook and be present at the holiday gatherings. I know it because we've been instructed from the platform of situations when the woman is a JW but now the husband. She's under your command per say, of course that's if you know how to play the game. In many JW households, even when she's not supposed to, the woman totally rules.
Mine ex went with me to the initial visit with a mental health therapist ( definition: my deprogrammers). You should see the things they wrote about her baaad attitude towards the 'head of the household.'
You are in for a whole new life that is going to to rock your world like it has never been rocked. You have my sincere sympathy.
-
jgnat
144001,
Mixed marriages with JWs rarely work.
There are a few of us out there. And we are on this board. I still vote for not freaking out on her. Time enough for that later.
-
RebelliousSpirit
144001,
Mixed marriages with JWs rarely work.
There are a few of us out there. And we are on this board. I still vote for not freaking out on her. Time enough for that later.
I second that, jgnat. Although it's not easy - a successful marriage to a JW is very possible - I think it depends solely upon the people involved and how they handle the situation. CYP is the best judge of his wife and their situation - and while he should keep a watchful eye, I don't think he needs to run for the hills just yet.
RS (Non-JW in a successful marriage to a JW - 8 years and still going strong)
-
Check_Your_Premises
I can't tell you how much it means to me to have your thoughts, prayers and suggestions. It means so much to me.
On Freaking out:
I have freaked out a little, but I am better now. I do beleive in God and I pray for him to help me. I know I have sinned in that I have not looked out sufficiently for my family. But I have repented, and He will help me.
On my current plans:
I have asked my wife on many occasions to pray to God to make her a lover of truth. If this is not the true religion to make it known to her so there can be no doubt. And likewise if it is, continue to make it known to her so there can be no doubt. When I asked her to do this it was like showing dracula the cross! But I have invoked my headship, and what I am asking is clearly scriptural, for we are supposed to keep "testing ourselves to know we are in the faith".
On the org, I have asked a couple of elders to come by. I am going to negotiate for her to put of baptism for six months. I am interested in their religion, but I have many serious questions. My wife is joining a religion, I have serious questions about, and since I am undecided I have to assume the worst. I am concerned about what effect it will have on my family, and I don't want her to get baptized (my irrational original position for negotiating purposes). The fact that I feel like I don't have control of my family means that I am starting to not feel very good about the religion (risk for them, I am still a prospect they don't want to lose!). Hopefully they will recommend, otherwise I will, that she wait for 6 months. If they give in on this, I will have to give in on something. I am willing to go to ALL the meetings until I "make up my mind".
(Actually, unlike them I am still open minded. I only love truth, not a particular doctrine. If a bush burns, some stones cry out, someone makes some wine, or hell, I would even listen to some reasoning that isn't their standard talking points I have heard a billion times already... if any of that happend I would be all ears! )
Any thoughts and prayers are greatly appreciated!