Biblical PROOF that Jesus Christ IS GOD

by Bibleboy 156 Replies latest watchtower bible

dubla

At present, the term "Mr. President" refers to George Bush. Let us say for example that JFK was God; this isn't blasphemy, just and example. Anyhow, "Mr. President" is used for both George Bush and JFK, but George Bush is NOT God in this case and would have to be JFK.

i hope everyone who's had a chance to read this thread, including hairdog, got a nice laugh out of this absolutely ridiculous and absurd comparison of the presidents and god. bibleboy, are we to assume that george bush and jfk are coequal in mind and thought then? what a preposterous comparison! almost as convincing as the three-in-one apple! please stick to scriptures and quit discrediting those that actually put up valid arguments (like hairdog) for the trinity.......you give trinitarians a bad name bibleboy, and you make it much easier for us non-trinitarians to show how ridiculous a notion the trinity actually is.
hairdog: your silence to my comments is surprising to me, and it tells me you must be embarrassed by your false conclusions, or that ive just given you thoughts to which you simply cannot reply.
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Scorpion

bibleboy,
It is nice that you know who God will save and who he will not. In your opinion from what I gather, all those who do not believe in a triune God will not be saved. I think that is pure hogwash.
You quoted Romans 10:9-10 Very good, I confess Jesus is Lord and he was raised from the dead by his father, God. Am I now saved in your eyes? I do not see any reference to believeing in a truine God.
In verse 5 of Romans chapter 10 Moses is mentioned, did Moses understand and teach a triune God? If not, was Moses saved or will he be saved?
As far as the tetragrammaton, I do not believe Jesus takes this name upon himself as the Father, God. What I see from this verse and comparing it to others such as John 8:24 is that when Jesus appropriates this name, he is claiming to be the one incomparable Saviour, the goal of Israel's faith and hope. God is unique and so is Jesus in the aspect that only Jesus can be compared to his father in the attributes they attain.
Bibleboy

Peace!
Why then did the Jews pick up stones to stone Him?
Stoning was a punishment for blasphemy. In THEIR eyes, Jesus was blaspheming. Jesus wasn't a liar or a lunatic so one possible answer remains. Jesus' claim that He is God Almighty. "I AM". There is no OTHER reason for them to stone Jesus. Otherwise they might have stoned John the baptist for claiming that he was the "voice of one calling in the desert". And they should have stoned Paul for preaching that Jesus was the Messiah.
No, stoning was for a person who committed blasphemy, or at least in the eyes of the Jews. Jesus was perfect; He declared that He was God; if He committed blasphemy then His work on the Cross is worth nothing which means prophecy failed and that means the bible isn't true which means we're ALL in trouble.
and jdubla, go take English 101 again. You obviously miss the point if you have to nit-pick all the time. And if you aren't going to listen to scripture then maybe I have to resort to "absolutely ridiculous and absurd comparison[s]" for your brain to understand. At least you're laughing. it's the best medicine for your condition.
Mark 4:10-12
10 When he was alone, the Twelve and the others around him asked him about the parables.
11 He told them, "The secret of the kingdom of God has been given to you. But to those on the outside everything is said in parables
12 so that, "`they may be ever seeing but never perceiving, and ever hearing but never understanding; otherwise they might turn and be forgiven!'"
Peace!
pomegranate

Isa 43:11
11 I, even I, am the LORD (YHWH),
and apart from me there is no Savior.
1 John 4:14-15
14 And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son to be the Savior of the world.
The YHWH Savior in Isa 43:11 must be the pre-human Jesus talking. Father YHWH sent Son YHWH to be the Savior of the world.
Luke 2:10-12
11 Today in the town of David a Savior has been born to you; he is Christ the Lord.
The evidence between the OT and the NT alone supports Christ being YHWH. The OT uses the name YHWH thousands of times, the NT uses it not once. That would be what one would expect if the Savior YHWH of the OT (the YHWH who spoke ALL the words of the OT) reliquished his YHWH hood and became human. His name would be changed upon his being born as a man. The Father YHWH would have named His Son with a new name:
John 17:12
12 While I was with them, I protected them and kept them safe by that name you gave me.
"YHWH" Savior while in heaven.
"Christ" Savior while on earth.
"New name" Savior upon resurrection.
Rev 3:12
and I will also write on him my new name.
All are the Son whom the Father sent as the Savior of the world.
Reslight

[[Isa 43:11
11 I, even I, am the LORD (YHWH),
and apart from me there is no Savior.
1 John 4:14-15
14 And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son to be the Savior of the world.
The YHWH Savior in Isa 43:11 must be the pre-human Jesus talking. Father YHWH sent Son YHWH to be the Savior of the world.]]
No, Yahweh is the ultimate savior, but it is Yahweh, the God of Israel, who sends Jesus as savior, the prophet like Moses. -- Deuteronomy 18:15,17-19; John 3:16,17; Acts 3:22,23,34-36
Yahweh has sent many saviors (Strong's #3467) in his name. (Judges in general: Judges 2:16; Othniel - Judges 3:9; Gideon - Judges 6:13,14; 8:22; Gideon's 700: Judges 7:7; Samson - Judges 13:5; David - 2 Samuel 3:18)
However, by their being sent by Yahweh and coming in his name signifies that Yahweh is still the only ultimate savior, thus it could still be said that there is no savior besides him.- (Gideon - Judges 7:2; 8:7; David - 2 Samuel 3:18)
I have given only a few examples; many more can be found by using using a Hebrew concordance.
Likewise Jesus was sent by and came in Yahweh's name: (John 17:3; 4:34; 5:30; Matthew 21:9; 23:39)
Additionally the saints are all called saviors, as they are part of the seed of Abraham with Jesus that will bless all the families of the earth during the Millennial rule.. -- Obadiah 21; Genesis 22:18; Galatians 3:29; Revelation 20:6; 22:26.
This proves that just because Jesus is called "savior" that it does not mean that he is Yahweh, the only true God. (John 17:1,3) Yahweh remains the only ultimate savior, to Israel, to the church, and to the world, since he is the one who has made arrangements for and sent a savior of the world.
[[Luke 2:10-12
11 Today in the town of David a Savior has been born to you; he is Christ the Lord.
The evidence between the OT and the NT alone supports Christ being YHWH.]]
No, it only supports that Jesus is the savior of mankind sent by Yahweh, the Most High.
[[The OT uses the name YHWH thousands of times, the NT uses it not once.]]
Jesus and the apostles surely were not disobedient, as were the apostate Jews, so as to desecrate God's holy name by replacing it with either Adonay, Elohim, Kurios or Theos. It is evident that the name has been replaced with titles, and there is evidence this was done very soon after the apostles died. Jesus certainly did not come in the name of a God by the name of Kurios. -- Matthew 23:39; Deuteronomy 18:20.
http://reslight.addr.com/l-name.html
However, the short form of God's name does appear in the Received Text in Revelation 19:1,3,4,6.
[[That would be what one would expect if the Savior YHWH of the OT (the YHWH who spoke ALL the words of the OT) reliquished his YHWH hood and became human. His name would be changed upon his being born as a man.]]
Of course this fable is no where to be found in the Bible, and there is no reason to add it to the Bible (except to satisfy the false teaching that Jesus is Yahweh). Jesus came in the name of Yahweh; he was sent by Yahweh; he was not Yahweh who sent him. -- Deuteronomy 18:15,18; Matthew 23:39; Mark 11:9,10; Luke 13:35; John 3:2,17; 5:19,43; 7:16,28; 8:26,28,38; 10:25; 12:49,50; 14:10; 15:15; 17:8,26; Hebrews 1:1,2; Revelation 1:1
[[The Father YHWH would have named His Son with a new name:]]
At least you recognize that Yahweh is the Father of Jesus. Of course, to any reasoning mind this shows that Jesus is not Yahweh. There is nothing in the Bible about three persons in the one true God, Yahweh.
See:
http://reslight.addr.com/saviors.html
http://reslight.addr.com/name.html
pomegranate

"APART FROM ME THERE IS NO OTHER."
No, Yahweh is the ultimate savior,
Can you show me the wording "ultimate savior" in the Bible?
>>It is evident that the name has been replaced with titles<<
It is NEITHER evident (show your evidence) nor true. The OT copies that are all much older in age than the NT manuscripts have the "name" intact. You would have me believe that all of the much more recent Greek manuscripts had the name removed for some odd reason. The Greek manuscripts are wholey supported by ALL educated examiners, to be accurate renderings of the original penmen (including the absence of "the name"). You have to defy that fact of the absence in order to prove yourself. Well, it is a fact, and I know you have no evidence.
YHWH is Father and Son. YHWH is the surname of the Almighty being who are Father and Son.
Isa 41:21-23
21 "Present your case," says the LORD (YHWH).
Please note WHO is talking here.
"Set forth your arguments," says Jacob's King.
Again, please note YHWH, Jacob's King is the one who speaks this passage of scripture.
22 "Bring in [ your idols] to tell US
what is going to happen.
Please note YHWH has just refered to HIMSELF as the plural pronoun US
Tell US what the former things were,
so that WE may consider them
and know their final outcome.
Please note YHWH AGAIN has just refered to HIMSELF as the plural pronoun US and WE
Or declare to US the things to come,
Please note YHWH AGAIN has just refered to HIMSELF as the plural pronounUS
23 tell US what the future holds,
Please note YHWH AGAIN has just refered to HIMSELF as the plural pronoun US
so WE may know that you are gods.
Please note YHWH AGAIN has just refered to HIMSELF as the plural pronoun WE
Do something, whether good or bad,
so that WE will be dismayed and filled with fear.
Please note YHWH AGAIN has just refered to HIMSELF as the plural pronoun WE
It is ONLY YHWH that is speaking in this passage, and He refers to HIMSELF as US and WE.
They, the Father and Son, are God YHWH, neither created, both from eternity, and BOTH are ULTIMATE SAVIOR of the world.
Scorpion

Hello bibleboy,
This is one reason I try to avoid this type of debate. Individuals raise scriptures with questions that lead to nothing more than more scriptures with questions for debate. Like I said originally, this leads to a dead end.
You qouted Romans 10:9-10. I answered. Now tell me that I am not saved, or do you believe I am by confessing Jesus as Lord as mentioned in Romans 10? I see nothing in Romans or any where else in the Bible that one must believe in the doctrine of the trinity to be saved. Do you?
Please answer.
Reslight

[[Isa 41:21-23
21 "Present your case," says the LORD (YHWH).
Please note WHO is talking here.
"Set forth your arguments," says Jacob's King.
Again, please note YHWH, Jacob's King is the one who speaks this passage of scripture.
22 "Bring in [ your idols] to tell US
what is going to happen.]]
Only someone who is looking for something to prove that Yahweh is more than one person would think that Yahweh is referring to himself as "us", "we" here. Anyone else would look at what is being said in context and come to the conclusion that Yahweh is speaking of himself and Israel as "us" and "we".
pomegranate

>>Anyone else would look at what is being said in context and come to the conclusion that Yahweh is speaking of himself and Israel as "us" and "we".<<
Dear sir,
You have made a blatant error IN CONTEXT. Chapter 41 of Isaiah is YHWH speaking TO Israel because of her wayward adulterous ways. She had become corrupted by making her religious alliances with the Satanic nations around her.
The context of chapter 41 of Isaiah is YHWH speaking to the Israelites.
Proof is in the chapter itself as God says the good tidings He can do for Israel. (Isaiah 41:14-20)
Isa 41:14
14 Do not be afraid, O worm Jacob,
O little Israel,
for I myself will help you," declares the LORD,
Israel is THE one this whole context is being directed to.
The ones YHWH is speaking TO are the Israelites.
When we get to verses 20-24, God is still speaking TO the Israelites. He is speaking to NO ONE ELSE. The context of the ones God is directing this prophecy TO does NOT change in the middle of the chapter. He is still speaking TO the Israelites.
When God says "bring in your idols" he is speaking to the WAYWARD and ADULTEROUS Israelites who have become corrupt by their false worship and alliances with the nations around them.
Again the context is plain, when God speaks of all the good things he can do to Israel, He notes He has a problem. And it is plain:
Isa 41:27-29
27 I was the first to tell Zion, 'Look, here they are!'
I gave to Jerusalem a messenger of good tidings.
28 I look but there is no one-- (Israel worships idols)
no one among them to give counsel, (Israel has gone to false gods)
no one to give answer when I ask them. (They have become perverted)
29 See, they are all false! (Talking about Israel's FALSE gods)
Their deeds amount to nothing;
their images are but wind and confusion. (That's why God uses another nation to bash Israel because of her perversions in YHWH's face)
Correct your contextual understanding and know that YHWH is two. Father and Son.
pomegranate

I honor the Father as God. I honor the Father as Creator. I honor the Father as omniscient, omnipotent and omnipresent. I honor the Father as the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. I honor the Father as the one who gave me my life. I honor the Father as the Holy Spirit. I give the Father the highest HONOR in all of my being strength and power.
John 5:23
23...all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father.
I honor the Son as God. I honor the Son as Creator. I honor the Son as omniscient, omnipotent and omnipresent. I honor the Son as the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. I honor the Son as the one who gave me my life. I honor the Son as the Holy Spirit. I give the Son the highest HONOR in all of my being strength and power.
Like Father, like Son. They are the Holy Spirit. They are two that become one united God, just as the male and female are two that become one united man.
Those who deny Christ as God and give Him the FULL honor that is demanded by scripture, will have some serious explaining to do.

Biblical PROOF that Jesus Christ IS GOD

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