I think this camel's back is broken (the final straw) (page 5)

Awakened at Gilead

My mom got DFd last week and she is so happy. DAing is all its cracked up to be... Go for it!

Freedom rocks!

Quandry

Your wife WANTS to go to several men and discuss the sexual things she did? Does she realize that these men will in all probability go and tell their wives, and they in turn will tell their friends?

Tell her that in many cases the elders will want ALL the details, so maybe she should start making journal entries of her memories in case they ask who did what to who.

If you do go with her, maybe YOU should begin telling all the intimate details as she sits there.

Tell her that's what you thought she wanted.

The only letter you need write is one for your wife to deliver to the Elders. It should inform them that your wife has gone over your head in attempting to draw them into your marital life. Give assurance that things are fine between you and the missus but also give them full permission to counsel her on headship within the Jehovah's marital arrangement. Send your appreciation for their discernment in this unfortunate matter and should you need any further assistance you will personally contact them.... Wifey should also be told to 'appologize' to the Elders for 'inconviencing' them.

For further 'punishment' I would work up a lesson from the Song of Solomon lasting for at least two weeks........(but only if oral sex isn't already an appetizer on yalls sexual menu... not many Dubbie wives go tattling if they are the ones receiving pleasures.....)

This way when you DA it is on your own terms not some forced situation...........

Best wishes to both of you.....

I quit!

I have to say go easy on JP's wife. Just because he has seen the truth about the WT it doesn't mean she will at the same time. I'm sure she is scared and confused about what is going on. Her world is changing in a way she never thought it would. Most of us here at one time would have reacted in a way similar to the way she is acting. I think what he is doing has to be done and I think he is doing a pretty good job of handling a very difficult situation. I was in a similar situation when I decide to leave. I hated putting my wife through it but I had no choice. They don't make it easy for you to leave. Those rotten old buggers that run it have set it up to do as much harm to you and your family as possible if you try to leave.

As for the premarital sex I would tell them that my sex life past or present was none of their business and that they had no more right discussing it with my wife than I did with theirs. At this point I think they will do whatever they can to cause trouble in JPs life. In my letter I sent to the WT when I left I told them I would sue them if they did anything to break up my marriage. I think he needs to be as loving as possible with his wife but at the same time not take any crap from them. They are paper tigers and have no real power anyway. Only what you allow them.

sacolton

I'd have to agree. She's called it in, let her face the charges. Send in your DA letter and wipe your hands clean of it and thank her for helping to make the decision.

MissingLink

DAing may be the right thing for you, but may not help your wife. Suck it up man and do what's going to help her the most. Perhaps DAing is right, I don't know. But think it thru and don't just go on what makes you feel good.

Consider that if you're not taking a harsh stance, but just trying to reason things out, and they DF you for it. Perhaps she'll see the punishment as overly harsh and start to sympothise with your position.

Think it through. Put yourself in her shoes. And do what you think has the best chance of getting your family free.

Black Sheep

You could go along with her and put her pot on and get her DFd for her premarital no nos........

........then DA yourself before they DF you.

Cheers

Chris

cameo-d

Missing link says: "Consider that if you're not taking a harsh stance, but just trying to reason things out, and they DF you for it."

Page, this is an interesting thought. Suppose you let it play out just the way you told her it would?

Do you think she would remember this conversation? Or perhaps you could often remind her of what you said. Maybe then if you are DF you can tell her "I told you so." Maybe she will see that it's her fault for the action that she took.

When I felt the moment was right I talked to her calmly. I said, "I have something to say and will you listen to me without condemning me?" She said yes.

(hmmmm... are her words and actions in agreement here?)

I told her that I loved everyone in the congregation. I told her that I had been brought up to believe in Armageddon and Paradise and now I'm 36 years old. I have a kid now whom I don't want to lie to. I said that the generation of Matthew 24 has meant 3 different things since I've been alive. I reminded her that I used to be like the pioneers in the congregation are now. I was a servant and had applied to go to Bethel.

I said I'm scared to say anything because I'm not allowed to have my own opinion. She disagreed with that. I said, "You are not allowed to have an opinion that differs from the Watchtower Society. If you do, they will try to cut you off from your family. I hope that you will not leave me and try to take my child away from me."

(If you let it play out and they DF and perhaps you would prove your point. However, going through the humiliation of these "punishment talks" and subjecting yourself to demeaning questions would not be worth it. They will strip you of your manhood and self governance right in front of your wife. You will forever be belittled in her eyes. They will chew you up and spit you out. You will have no chance to discuss doctrinal issues because YOU are on trial for something else and she put you there.)

For what you will go through if you subject yourself to their authority, you will loose your dignity and be left with self-loathing.

You know what is really sad here? As far as the premarital sex....what should have been a sweet moment to be forever cherished by the two of you has now been destroyed by WT dictates. When you bring in other people to know all the intimate details of your life...then what do the two of you have to share that is exclusively between you? What is left to create a special bond? Your marriage becomes a committee matter...your every action, sex position, etc. is laid bare to be judged and dictated by a group of perverted old men? And it's not even a jury of peers. It seems really creepy and perverted that your wife would want to tell her sexual escapades to a bunch of old men to entertain them. Where is her dignity?

BluesBrother

Do what you feel is best..but I cannot see any benefit in d/a'ing. It just hands them your head on a platter. I would want to be stubborn and give them a run for their money..

What do they really have on you? The Bible says that "At the mouth of 2 witnesses let a matter be proven" Right now they have only one.

Many years ago at an elders school the instructor (David Gibson, who was well known in the U K back then)posed this hypothetical situation. "What if a sister confessed to fornication with a brother, but the brother denies that it ever happened, and everything was in order in their relationship?"

The answer? you should believe the brother because there was only one persons word against him - and you should convene a committee to judge the sister as a self confessed fornicator"

I do not know how your own elders would react to this case of course, but I know that they have nothing on you unless you confirm your wife's story.

BTW, those who criticise Jimmy's wife have to remember the great pressure she is in, as a cult member ,she cannot help but feel guilt - cut her some slack!

dinah

The answer? you should believe the brother because there was only one persons word against him - and you should convene a committee to judge the sister as a self confessed fornicator"

That is just WRONG on so many levels. How can they charge her as a self confessed fornicator if she didn't have a tango partner? But the whole Judicial Committee CRAP is for another thread.

I agree about the ones who came down so hard on JP's wife. Most of us have had our blinders off for quite a while. Think back to how you would feel if you still believed every word the WT said. In his wife's mind JP will DIE if he leaves the WT. She simply panicked and called another JW for "help". My two cents on that.

I don't envy the positions you guys are in who have spouses who still believe. That would have to be about the hardest situation you could face when you try to leave.

I think this camel's back is broken (the final straw)