An Old Argument.... does it hold water?

by AK - Jeff 1495 Replies latest jw experiences

• 

  AGuest

  EP has the kind of mind that can see only error. He/she can see nothing good.

  Nah, he's not really like that, dear N.drew (the greatest of love and peace to you, girl!). Usually, it's when he's had a "child's portion" of whiskey the night before (or perhaps "recovering" from a "teenchie" adult portion today, dear EP? Peace to you, my bruh!). Look past all that, though, dear one... and you'll "see" a pretty cool guy.

  And amazingly it's just like modern American English! Or is it?

  Well, it doesn't really SOUND like any American or English words I know, dear one... but writing "sounds" really isn't all that easy. Know what I mean? What can I say: I do the best I can.

  Peace to you, both!

  YOUR servant, both, and a slave of Christ,

  SA
• 

  sizemik

  I absolutely do. I know it. How? Because I know my Lord... AGuest.

  The problem here is exemplified by this statement. As long as this argument "holds water" in the mind of a believer . . . there will never come an answer to the OP from such a source. The Christians here are simply wasting everybody's time . . . including their own.

  What possible value is there in taking a position that only makes sense to you? . . . what possible value is there in saying such a thing? . . . to anybody? That's what's insulting . . . the only way you can get a positive response is for someone to say. "Oh yes . . . what AGuest says is so true . . . it must be because her Lord told her so." I'm amazed that you can't see how inane that is when presenting an argument.
• 

  jay88

  If I wasn't married I would have pulled my hair with your both (Shel and Tam)

  You both know, especially Shelby, that you could have been more clear about your statements.

  Thanks for following thru, with questions you did not have to answer.
• 

  AGuest

  The Christians here are simply wasting everybody's time . . . including their own.

  And, yet, you all keep asking "us" questions... and challenging our beliefs, dear Size (peace to you!). Our reason for being on this thread and responding is clear: to accommodate YOU... who keeping asking of US. For that reason, we continually exercise OUR free will... and respond... even though you don't want, get, understand, comprehend, believe, or agree. I must ask, though, why YOU wasting YOUR time, here... with "us" and what we believe in... in the first place? Won't YOUR free will allow you to just leave/ignore "us"?

  What possible value is there in taking a position that only makes sense to you?

  Ummmm... the same value that there is in taking a position that only makes sense to YOU... and those who agree with/think like YOU?

  . . . what possible value is there in saying such a thing? . . . to anybody?

  I didn't state it for the purpose of value, dear one... other than the value that is associated with truth. Some value truth (I do!); some don't. For the former, this wouldn't be such a bad thing to have stated. For the latter... doesn't really matter what I state, does it? It could be a bald-faced lie... but if they "like" it... then it will have some "value" to them. Empty value, IMHO, but one man's "trash" is another man's "treasure", yes?

  That's what's insulting . . . the only way you can get a positive response is for someone to say. "Oh yes . . . what AGuest says is so true . . . it must be because her Lord told her so."

  (Smile). No, dear one. I get a positive "response" from my Lord... and my own spirit... because I stated the truth. Even if no one else believes me. No one else needs to. Truth isn't contingent upon positive responses... or humans believing it. It simply is... what it is.

  I'm amazed that you can't see how inane that is when presenting an argument.

  I wasn't presenting an argument, dear Size. I rarely do here. I simply stated the truth. Nothing TO argue.

  I am sorry that YOU need a positive response from someone to validate a truth. I do not. I stated it because it is the truth... regardless of whether others think it is or don't. And regardless of the response it might evoke... positive OR negative. (BTW - I expect the responses to be negative much more often than positive. Surely, you understand that?)

  Again, peace to you!

  YOUR servant and a slave of Christ,

  SA, who doesn't quite understand dear Jay's (peace!) latest comment about being "more clear." If my comment "neither are unrighteous so as to forget the truly innocent," I don't know what else to tell you...
• 

  AGuest

  You know?

  I absolutely do, dear one (as always, peace!)... and you have no need to apologize to anyone, IMHO. You haven't even come close to the kinds of attitude and responses being thrown YOUR way, so...

  Dear N.drew... peace to you, as well... and I hope I didn't... ummmmm... stumble or offend you with my comments re dear EP (peace!). It's just that I've been where you are with him right now... worse, actually... but after a time we came to have an kind of unspoken "affection" for one another that transcended all of this (I think - I hope - LOLOLOL!). I have no doubt that you will, too, and come to see that he's a lot more bark than bite (as are a whole lot of the boyz on this forum. Many reminded me of my dear chihuahua, Louie - he's only six pounds but HE thinks he's a rottweiler... and so will take on ANY big dog that comes in his path. Those big dogs usually lumber on by, not giving him a thought - or try to "play" and almost trample him. But on occasion, he runs into one that won't stand for his... ummmmm... "doo-doo". I see you as the big dog in this thread, my dear one - LOLOLOLOL!)

  Peace to you both, my dear sisters in Christ! Keep up the fine "fight"... and don't let ANYONE'S attempt to invalidate you OR your faith win out. As our Lord said, "Take heart, I have conquered the world!" You will "conquer" it, as well, I have NO doubt!

  YOUR servant, sister, and fellow slave of Christ,

  SA, who meant to type "... you certainly can't let them overcome with their attempts to INvalidate" (which I know you know - )...
• 

  poopsiecakes

  
• 

  N.drew

  Hahaha! I don't know how to say it and when I do say it it looks OK to me. shhhh. I ramble, but not all the time. So why does he judge me by my worst post and do I really make no sense at all? Is that possible?
• 

  AK - Jeff

  What I find interesting to contemplate in review of the fairy-tale arguments presented here by the believers guild is this:

  Yahweh, Allah, and Buddha are very different gods. No one here believes in all of them. It can likely be safely stated that all of the believers here consider themselves superior for they have 'found the true god'. You stubbornly refuse to see that your 'faith' is nothing more than something borrowed from your culture - you are not special to the Christian God - you were just born into a Christian culture. That fact supports the argument that your faith is not 'special' - you are not specially selected by any of the gods mentioned. You are basically a victim of your circumstances. No more, no less.

  You are defending then an idea - a concept - not reality. You cannot prove that your god exists and the Buddhist god does not, can you? You and the Buddhist are equally deluded, by the same concept that has deluded superstitious men and women for centuries. And the root of that superstition is selfishness - you are too good to die forever. You are not like 'them', those evil pagans [even the starving Muslim children in Africa].

  You will go likely to your own graves defending a concept that neither you nor anyone else has ever defended with logical proof or even logical evidence that might lead to proof. You will do this because you are afraid to die - forever dead that is. You are worthy of more than that - surely god has a plan for you. And you continue to think that by showing 'faith' in this man construct called god that he will reward you.

  Even when confronted with options as to why God does not act [first post in case you forgot], the same confrontation made by logical minds and philosophers over thousands of years of time - you just punt. You don't/won't/can't discuss the logical argument, that leads to one of the conclusions listed, because it violates the fantasy you have built in your mind - your personal dissonance. So you seek tangents. You refuse to answer the specifics of the philosophical logic and divert the discussion all over hells half acre.

  WHAT ARROGANCE! By seeking to defend your self-serving position you are willing to ignore the pain and suffering of millions of dying children every year with a whisk of the hand, saying 'God has a better plan for them'. You blame mankind, who in his limited power has failed to overcome the difficult circumstances involved to eliminate these disasters - though he has surely tried. Can you refuse forever to see that if all of mankind would drop the religious nonsense of believing in invisible beings who have to date shown precisely zero interest in solving these major problems - if just that idiocy was disbanded - perhaps mankind could find ways to solve the problem. The problem is faith. Not a lack of it. Religion has always been the barrier that divides mankind. After all - why bother? God will fix it all eventually - right? Why should the fact that my god allows millions of starving children to die every year indicate that perhaps he doesn't really care - or gasp - might not even be real except in my mind?

  WOW.

  Night all.

  Jeff
• 

  WontLeave

  Once again, a main argument of atheists is against an unscriptural lie told by theists. Yet, the functionally illiterate theists can't understand why lying about the Bible is harmful to their cause. They have created their own straw man for the atheists to pick apart, because their rewriting of the Bible is illogical, erroneous, and paints God as evil.

  On behalf of sane Christians with living synapses, I apologize for the ones who believe God speaks to them, heals them, and got them that raise they prayed for. These self-proclaimed Bible scholars are in direct violation of Scripture, but their IQs are too low to comprehend what they read in the Bible, they are too lazy to read the Bible, they are too mentally ill, or they are too brainwashed by their church to realize it. Anyone who claims to hear God, speak in tongues, get wishes (aka "prayers") granted, possess divinely-inspired knowledge, etc., is insane and should be treated as such. Nothing they say should reflect negatively on Scripture, God, or Christianity.

  Especially in the US - but elsewhere as well - the nutters have hijacked religion and turned it into a contest to see who can exercise their "faith" by acting the most ridiculous, stupid, and crazy. It appears that some of the finalists have made it to this forum.
• 

  still thinking

  That is sad, but also fully within OUR power to stop from happening.

  tec....I have to disagree...It is not within my power to stop that happening...And I doubt yours.

  The only person/thing/being that would have the power to stop it is God...and he chooses not to.