Oklahoma beheading - Islam is a disease
by Simon 1524 Replies latest members adult
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new hope and happiness
I dont want to cause an argument.
But statistics ?
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new hope and happiness
I do not feel qualified to continue this debate.
But my comment to Jgnets post on page 56 " statistics" was based on my comment on page 55.
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AlphaMan
Sure there are many moderate Muslims in the Western countries.
Any protests by Muslims in Western countries against radical Islam are few and very insignfiicant.
Moderate and radical Muslims all practise their believe that Islam is the true religion, worship Allah as the true God, and recognize Mohammad as his true Prophet in the same Mosques.
Whereas the Bible told unproven OT historical accounts of the Israelites killing numerous peoples, with the NT not telling Christians to kill, but rather to love their neighbors & enemies....the Koran gives present tense commands for Muslims to hate & kill all non-Muslim infidels. Beheading being the preferred method. Present day facts show Muslims have killed and currently are killing thousands around the world because of Islam.
Islam has teachings similar to JW theocratic warfare where Muslims can lie to infidels in order to gain trust, acceptance, and deceive them until future time to defeat & kill them.
Western countries have made significant progress in women's & homosexual's rights. Islam is still killing homosexuals and treating women like property.
No Muslims of any merit are calling bullshit on the whole religion.....that there is no Allah, Mohammad was a terrible person, and that the Koran is a man-written hate filled book that even today calls for killing of non-Muslims in order to please the teachings of the religion.
How can Western people ever really trust members of this religion when you know exactly what the Koran says and teaches Muslims?
That "nice" Muslim can be your co-worker one day, then be hacking your head of tomorrow.
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poopsiecakes
It is very hard to say where the line between 'moderate' and 'extreme' is drawn. Women and how they're treated are (in my opinion) a very strong litmus paper on determining religious and cultural extremist lines. The hijab is said by moderate Muslims to be an outword symbol of respect and boundaries in order for women to not be treated as sexual objects. Sounds pretty good, until you actually start critically thinking about it. The underlying (and overlying, if we're being honest) implication is that seeing a woman's hair and neck are so stimulating to a man that they must cover up in order to keep chaste. As far as I'm concerned, this only emphasizes the woman as a sexual object. Another under/over is that any woman NOT covered up in a hijab, niqab or burka is by extension a woman of loose morals - a thought I find objectionable.
It's not that I think every woman I see or speak with who wears the hijab is evil or that every man who believes the hijab is proper is evil. Quite the contraray. In my opinion, these are brainwashed people who haven't even bothered to notice that the Quran does not state that this is something women should be wearing. This came from the Mohammed legend and became tradition at that point. Also, the resurgance of the hijab in western or somewhat western countries is relatively recent. For example, look at how it was in Egypt in the 70's and 80's. The filming of Raiders of the Lost Ark is indicative and at that time, Muslim women did not feel the need to cover up the way they do now. Something changed along the way to instill a pervasive feeling of the hijab becoming a symbol of what a 'real' Muslim woman wears. This is where it becomes dangerous because once the line gets moved like this, and so easily, where does it stop?
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poopsiecakes
And just to expand on my point above - Muslim women will state categorically that wearing the hijab is a choice, not an enforced rule. This is exactly like everything I used to say as a JW. 'No, really. I've done all the reasearch (lol) and it is my choice to be in this religion.' 'I absolutely believe 100% that homosexuality is a gross sin against God.' 'Yes, getting baptized was totally my choice.' 'Of course accepting a blood transfusion is wrong and it would be my choice to refuse it.' 'Well no, of course women shouldn't be up on a platform preaching - that goes against what God wants and it's my choice to be patient until the new system where that will probably change once we're perfect.'
Amazing how this happens and you honestly believe it's a choice, not lack of thinking...
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LoveUniHateExams
AlphaMan: 'Moderate and radical Muslims all practise their belief that Islam is the true religion, worship Allah as the true God and recognize Mohammad as his true Prophet in the same Mosques'.
Exactly - nobody can argue against this point.
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3rdgen
I agree with Simon's posts # 15584 and 15585. I agree with Alphaman posts #852 and 862. Poopsicakes 2874 and 2875-EXACTLY! When I was a JW I was very liberal in some ways like R rated movies, music, salty language, missing meetings, etc. I even spoke to DFed ones! HOWEVER: I carried the Blood card and refused ANY fractions. When my 3yo son was rushed to the hospital I resolutly prayed to uphold the blood doctrine and was preparing to face his death. Afiliation with a religion makes one SUSCEPTIBLE to its worst teachings, beliefs, and yes, behavior. I see Islam-JW comparasons valid. Let's say a moderate Islamic publicly denounces the ISIS atrocities. Is he DFed? That would be bad. Beheading would be worse! Many on this board have little patience with JW's who know the TTATT and stay. This is because staying, yet not believing, lends tacit support for the crazy.It gives no motivation for leadership to change. Let's say 50% of all JWs are more moderate/liberal than the GB would like. What if all 4,000,000 AT THE SAME TIME got up and walked out, and wrote letters saying not one penny more will be donated and they will be gone untill such time as reform.? No matter how extreme, these organizations depend on financial and physical support.
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3rdgen
Simon: "Why is it so onerous to ask people not to promote messages that contain dangerous beliefs if they do not hold these beliefs?" Why indeed. Doesn't the fact that precious little is being done in protest by their own people tell us something? Either they silently agree, mildly disagree but can't be bothered, or they are terrified of the consequences of public protest. ALL equally bad.
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Gregor
3rdgen,
well said.