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An Old Argument.... does it hold water?
by AK - Jeff 1495 Replies latest jw experiences
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N.drew
? You got two people saying the past defines the present. There are many mistakes in the past. We should learn from the mistakes of the past, but should never let the past rule. But that is what you do. A true believer believes in a living God. A forgiving God. A making all things new God. As much as you don't like people believing in falsehood, we don't either. As a matter of fact more so. But you are so sure we are wrong about our core belief, you make yourself god. My God is reality. If I do such and such I get result, good or bad. put that all together with all the people, that means the Our Father. You see, if you finish your life one way, it defines your opinion of yourself. The I Am also is living, do you understand? A computer can develop some "intelligence" but you refuse to believe the I AM can? That doesn't make sense.
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WontLeave
Won'tleave? are you posting on the wrong thread?
The entire premise of this thread is divine intervention (or lack thereof). People who pray for God to help them get a job that allows them to pioneer, pray for world peace, pray to heal, or really ask for much of anything are deluded. Why does God allow suffering? Because he's not in charge. He has made it clear, he is no longer "hands-on", like he was with Israel. In fact, for the rest of the world, he always was. Woe for the earth, because the Devil has come down to you. What would be the point of God jumping in to fix things here and there, but not fix everything permanently? Things are bad everywhere, but people are making things worse in some places more than in others. Why stop starvation in Africa and allow people to die of cancer? Why do people expect some half-assed salvation?
Religious idiots try to spread stories about modern miracles, in an attempt to prove their belief in God. What they actually do is undermine any miracles that have ever happened as just some other lie told in an old book. They also make God out to be wishy-washy and arbitrary. Why would he intervene for one person but not another? Why would he fix one ill but not another? These lies allow retards like the "Why won't God heal amputees?" guy to spread their illogical arguments. The truth is, nobody is being healed. Nobody is being saved. God isn't intervening on behalf of anyone, any time, for any reason. He's also not testing anyone, cursing anyone, or punishing anyone.
A time has been set for intervention and that time hasn't come yet.
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N.drew
I'm sorry, but I like your rant. It is prophesied that God will hand the kingdom over to his son Jesus Christ. Maybe what it means is Jesus will lead us in the way of righteousness for he is called the "son of man". So if that is so in our days, then you are righty right. Jehovah is not intervening. It is up to all of us to see us through. If we follow Jesus' lead we will be happy, but to follow one must believe.
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OnTheWayOut
I have seen the light. God is very very busy rescueing healthy middleclass people from cults, fulfilling their needs like making their mate show up when they are in a home full of atheists, or leading them to particular churches He doesn't lead everyone to. He is too busy opening up Bibles right to the appropriate page to bother with innocent Asian children in floods or African children starving.
My mother knows that God is with JW's because He answered some specific prayers. Sometimes, things that people asked Isis or Jupiter to provide showed up. I can pray for God not to prove himself to atheist scum and He does just that.
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N.drew
You want a sign? The no god is being mean to the babies? You are being mean to the posters. Being mean when you have the ability to be nice means you do not exist. Do you know you do not exist?
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OnTheWayOut
so true, Miss Drew. I prayed someone would figure that out.
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AGuest
May you all have peace! Well, this is turning out to be one of those "usual"... ummmmm... curious... "discussions." I can see how someone who BELIEVES in God might get angry [at him] for what they see occurring in the world. I can see how they could ask "why". I can even see how some of the "answers" wouldn't suffice for them. To such ones, I would say, as did my Lord... KEEP asking; it WILL be opened to you.
I can NOT, however, see the... ummmmm... intelligence, rationality, even lucidity... in someone getting angry with, blaming, calling names, even CURSING... someone they DON'T BELIEVE EXISTS. I mean, someone they CLAIM they don't believe exists. I mean, some folks call ME "crazy".
When I see these arguments/comments, I try to imagine what in the WORLD would make me say similar as to/of/about/to, say, the FSM. Wouldn't I be the fool... the idjit... the delusional one... for arguing as to, about, to, "with"... something/someone I don't even BELIEVE exists??? Just who is it I am challenging, cursing, taking issue with, blaming??
It is MHO, then, that it really isn't me who is delusional. I don't argue with or about entities I don't believe exist... or perhaps even KNOW don't exist. Why? Because it doesn't exist as far as I'm concerned and so why argue with/about "it"?
(Shaking head) Call me "slow," but this discussion has opened my eyes probably more than any other in all the time I've been on this board. It says to ME that either someone(s) is/are lying about what they believe... are the epitome of arrogance ("I can argue about whatever I want, even things I don't believe in!")... or utterly bonkers.
Since I don't like it when people insinuate that I'm bonkers, and while I perceive that some may be a little arrogant (but not enough to put me off)... I'm inclined to go with the first one.
Call me crazy... but at least I'm honest about what (and who)... I believe in and DON'T believe in.
Now, where's that FSM - I've got a bone to pick with him (or is he a she?). Probably hanging out with the IPU... which I also don't believe in and so don't get into the arguments/discussions/debates/cursing/blaming or other backs and forths with... or about... "it". Silly me.
Peace!
A slave of JAHESHUA, the Chosen One of JAH, who is the MOST Holy One of Israel, aka "God",
SA, who feels quite a bit less "crazy" that some here...
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tec
Tec - I'm fairly sure I could design a better solution than evolution (oops the greatest invisible magic man ever) came up with.
LOL. I'm fairly certain you (in your limited years, view, and knowledge) cannot ;)
Let me give you an example. Childbirth could be painless and a euphoric experience from first contraction to last. The brain could be designed with an inbuilt option to switch off pain with a conscious choice so after it has done its job of warning of damage that pain could be switched off allowing you to still function rather than sending us, in extreme cases, into shock.
Really? How many people take medicine or painkillers and then go ahead and push themselves when they should be resting? If we could turn off pain after the warning sign... we would just finish that one thing, or 'know' that we could handle doing just a little more. We all lead such busy lives after all.
If I have to suffer because God set up a stupid test that Adam had to fail ( I'll prove it if you want ) then god is an unfair , mischievous sadist who clearly planned all the pain and suffering from mthe get go.
You suffer because of the decisions made from generations before you (leaving the world you live in in this sort of state), and because of your own personal decisions, today.
If Allah was the true god, would you agree to raise your children as muslim if it meant equality for all?
Which version? I'm sure there are as many versions of Allah as there are of Jahveh.
As for my answer, if I thought it was right, then yes I would. Or at least I would try.
Peace,
Tammy
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tec
es, the biggest killers of all... wars, coups, and genocides. Wars caused by religion, coups by certain militant religious groups, and genocides of entire religions by other religions. These types of war, and these types of aggression are the ones that kill the most. Read the Old Testament, and find all the genocides, war, and coups that God instructed his people to act out.
Don't worry. Wars, coups, and genocides would still be carried out under a different banner, even without religion. People will invent whatever reason they can to take what they want from others, and convince others to help them. Or to act out the violence in their hearts.
Just because someone says they fought a war in God's name, doesn't mean that they actually did.
Faith and relgion are not the same thing, btw.
Peace,
tammy