Does anybody still believe in God and the Bible?

by tornapart 218 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  sabastious

  That may be true. It may not be true. We, as a species, if we survive long enough, will see. Your assertion that it is impossible reminds me of people saying that human flight was impossible, or traveling faster than sound, or an expanding universe.

  And you acuse me of misrepresenting science? Science has a constant and it's called the speed of light and 3.14. Do you think those things will ever change? The word impossible is on our dictionary for a reason. The speed of light is used in countless calculations in many disciplines as is Pi.

  -Sab
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  sabastious

  That's how human stories (like the Bible) go. The universe functions very differently. We don't know what the start was or if there is an end. I don't see exactly how that relates to evolution, per se, since evolution definitely had a start, but again we don't know what the end is or if there is one.

  The evolution of the raw material on Earth had a start. What about the evolution of space and rime? Energy?

  -Sab
• 

  EntirelyPossible

  I think you fail to understand the true importance of ancient agreement.

  You are doing everything you can to narrow this down to your God of choice and failing to answer a simple question. This is NOT just about the latecomer Abrahamic religions. There are writings far older than those. What about them?

  The Bible has been shown to be influenced by other cultures. To me this puts more credence in the Bible because it seems to be written with everyone in mind.

  It shows that you don't understand anthropology, history, textual criticism or archeology.

  It consolidates all rituals down to love. It's got a lot of room for overlords to get a hold of it and create empires, but that's just a misuse of a powerful book.

  Yeah, they loved slaves, genocide, patricide, matricide, incest, murder, abortion, etc. It's part and parcel OF the book. Don't wimp out and deny your bible. Accept it for what it is.

  Your attempts to minimize it fall short.

  Sorry, not quite. I am suggesting we look at it in it's full glory, not minimize by saying it all boils down to love. It has a lot of stuff in there. Let's talk about ALL of it. Why are you afraid of talking about all of it? Are you ashamed of talking about it? Murdering slaves and babies ain't your cup o' tea? God did it for love. Let's talk about what he did AND why.
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  sabastious

  But, in the spirit of conjecture perhaps that First Cause that you want to be God, whatever plane of existence he lives in, consider HIS realm to be corporeal and had a first cause as well. I mean, if we are too complex to have spontaneously arisen, something more infinitely complex must have ALSO had a first cause, and THAT first cause PRIME must have ALSO had a first cause.

  I belive his realm IS corporeal from his perspective because I believe him to be a person of sort. But his perspective is not compatible with mine, but that doesn't mean it's not possible for him to cause me. I have toyed with the idea that God's universe is just bigger than ours. If there is life on a planet that takes 1000 years for a single day than those lifeforms would be immense in comparison to us. Communication would be tricky.

  -Sab
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  sabastious

  You are doing everything you can to narrow this down to your God of choice

  The theme of Love in the Bible is what narrows down my options. Eastern concepts are similar, but a little cold for my taste.

  -Sab
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  EntirelyPossible

  So your explanation is that our ancients misinterpreted their surroundings because of lack of knowledge. Do you have evidence for these misinterpretations?

  Yes. People thought gods caused volcanos to erupt and lightning to happen. We know that is not true now.

  It's just a typical scenario of a hot head atheist putting himself on God's throne to explain away God.

  It's an empty throne. It's not like anyone is sitting there. And I'm not a hothead. It just feels that way because you are in the hotseat getting roasted.

  Your logic is just as general and non falsifiable as mine

  Example? Yours is false, not falsifiable. Subtle but important distinction.

  The difference is that you insist that God doesn't exist I insist that there hasn't been enough work done yet for that conclusion.

  Patently false. You have said many times that you beleive in god. I have said many times that I personally don't but that it's possible there could be evidence for in the future.

  In the end both are merely opinions, but you will never admit that's what you have.

  Again, false. You clearly don't know me and don't understand the words I am writing. God could reveal himself in five minutes for all I know and then I would have to change what I think. That's how science works.

  You don't really know me at all. It's probably not in your best interest to claim to know how I would react or say to things about which you have no clue. I mean, you already did the internet tough guy thing. Do you really want tyo go down that road again?
• 

  sabastious

  Yeah, they loved slaves, genocide, patricide, matricide, incest, murder, abortion, etc. It's part and parcel OF the book. Don't wimp out and deny your bible. Accept it for what it is.

  Funny, I would ask the same of you. People have always used God as a justification for horror and it's recorded in the Bible. I don't believe that everytime the Bible says, "God said" that I think God is talking to me. My belief is in a God that permeates all culture including, but not limited to the Bible.

  Jesus said go therefore and baptize in the name of Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. He tore down the establishment of his time and replaced it with a message that I can get behind. I believe that God is Love and all the good that true love has given this world. I don't think love is a human construct, but a calling that can be followed or ignored.

  -Sab
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  sabastious

  It's an empty throne. It's not like anyone is sitting there. And I'm not a hothead. It just feels that way because you are in the hotseat getting roasted.

  I'll walk away from this conversation uplifted. I am merely trying to explain my beliefs to you and using the knowledge and experience I have since obtained. Put down the hot pitch fork and lets have a civilized conversation, please?

  -Sab
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  sabastious

  Example? Yours is false, not falsifiable. Subtle but important distinction.

  I don't care about right wrong. Why would I? If I had devoted my life to schooling or something I might have a motivation of being right, but I have a motivation of explaining my beliefs. You have not proven me wrong because I don't have a position that can be. I have not married myself to anything I have written, have I? I may have some straight foward language, but that doesn't mean everything I say should be scrutinized in the way you do. doing. But you scrutinize everyone because you have a complex of being right. Subtle but important distinction.

  I don't come at you with a "YOU'RE WRONG!" position. I have a belief and I have my reasons for it. You have not proven me wrong and there is no real roast taking place, just in your mind.

  -Sab
• 

  sabastious

  Again, false. You clearly don't know me and don't understand the words I am writing. God could reveal himself in five minutes for all I know and then I would have to change what I think. That's how science works.

  He could reveal himself in 5 minutes? Where is your evidence for this? The Bible states that whenever God talks there is roaring thunder and people's faces start glowing. Do you assume to know the process of which God is required to communicate with us? There's that throne talk again...

  -Sab