Oklahoma beheading - Islam is a disease

by Simon 1524 Replies latest members adult

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  lisaBObeesa

  No, it tells you that if 10% openly admit to holding an extreme viewpoint that there must be many others who also beileve but are sensible enough not to say and that in general there has to be widespread tollerance if not support for the viewpoint within that community.

  No, 10% of a population could openly admit to believing in idea A, it is possible that the rest of the population could not believe it or tolerate it at all.

  10% of the population believing in idea A does not prove that some secret portion of the remaing 90% also believes in idea A.
• 

  AlphaMan

  Here are some lovely verses from the holy book of the Muslims at your local Islamic Mosque.

  .

  http://bayelsanewmediateam.wordpress.com/2012/06/23/what-the-koran-says-about-non-muslims-christians-jews-etc/

  

  “Punish the unbelievers with garments of fire, hooked iron rods, boiling water; melt their skin and bellies” Koran 22:19
  “Kill the unbelievers wherever you find them” Koran 2:191
  “Make war on the infidels living in your neighborhood” Koran 9:123
  “When the opportunity arises, kill the infidels wherever you catch them” Koran 9:5
  “any religion other than Islam is not acceptable” Koran 3:85
  “the Jews and Christians are perverts; fight them” Koran 9:30
  “Maim and crucify the infidels if they criticize Islam” Koran 5:33
  “The unbelievers are stupid; urge the Muslims to fight them” Koran 8:65
  “Muslims must not take the infidels as friends” Koran 3:28
  “terrorize and behead those who believe in scriptures other than the Qur’an” Koran 8:12
  Muslims must muster weapons to terrorize the infidels” Koran 8:60
  Sura 47:4 Commands Moslems to smite the neck of anyone who did not accept the teachings of Islam. It says to strike them in the neck till many of them have been killed or wounded; until they embrace Islam”
• 

  Simon

  10% of the population believing in idea A does not prove that some secret portion of the remaing 90% also believes in idea A.

  Really? You're so naive that you think there is a perfectly clean cutoff like that? Wow.

  So if 5% of the population supports the KKK then there is no racism in the rest of the population at all ... right? I mean - by your reasoning.

  You still don't get the problem - 10% of supposedly "moderate muslims" believing that people should be killed for such hienous crimes as wanting to leave the 'religion', being born gay or drawing a cartoon makes people rightly question what the definition of "moderate muslim" really means. And it's not that I don't believe those people are muslim.
• 

  lisaBObeesa

  Really? You're so naive that you think there is a perfectly clean cutoff like that? Wow.

  So if 5% of the population supports the KKK then there is no racism in the rest of the population at all ... right? I mean - by your reasoning.

  No that is not what I said, and that is not my reasoning.

  One more time: The fact that 10% of the population openly believes in idea A does not prove that some secret portion of the remaining population also believes in idea A.
• 

  Qcmbr

  If everyone is biologically the same (contentious but lets not open a can of worms where people can shout racism) and one group acts differently to the other we can look to their culture and circumstances to explain the differences in behaviour. I see nothing in western culture that would cause the stoning of someone. Why is it difficult to see that the Quran is the major difference. If you truly believe everyone is the same then you are left with few alternatives to explain such evil.

  Just take a deep breath and allow yourself to admit that Islam is built on a mythical, medieval book that by modern standards is evil - its ok to say that using our free speech and without a need to accept any labels of bigotry or racism. There is no need to start whinging about moderates or anything else. Just criticise the book and recognise it for the vile tripe it is.
• 

  cofty

  Moderate muslims insist that the quran is a peaceful book and those who think otherwise just don't understand it. Apparently it's all about correct translation and context.

  This will not do.

  If there were just one or two controversial verses I could go along with it, but hatred for non-muslims is on every page of the quran and hadith.

  Is it really impossible to translate Arabic into English without making it sound like it means the precise opposite? Is big Al so incapable of transmitting a holy book for all people at all times? If the quran was only for the benefit of ancient muslims at war why are modern muslims continuing to learn it from infancy?

  All of the lame apologetics might have worked a few decades ago when the quran and hadith was shrouded im mystery like the bible was 600 years ago - hidden in a foreign tongue and protected by scholars. Along came Tyndale and we all noticed for the first time how much bullshit was in the good book. Now the internet poses the same challenge to the mumblings of Mo.

  There is only one solution. Millions of moderate muslims must claim the quran for themselves. They need to distill whatever virute there might be among the vitriol and admit the rest wasn't in fact the very words of Al after all.

  Christianity did it. It was messy and there were martyrs, but the result was an end to ideologically motivated mass murder.

  Qcmbr - I agree with your post very much. The book IS the problem. Or more precisely, the universal assumption of all muslims that it is the very words of big Al.
• 

  lisaBObeesa

  If everyone is biologically the same (contentious but lets not open a can of worms where people can shout racism) and one group acts differently to the other we can look to their culture and circumstances to explain the differences in behaviour.I see nothing in western culture that would cause the stoning of someone.

  Yes, we stick to lynching, shooting, beating, bombing federal buildings...things like that. Hardly ever throw stones at others in western culture. so true.
• 

  Qcmbr

  lisa - is stoning evil? Your inability to admit that an ancient book is evil seems very telling. Do you believe in it or do you want to protect a fairytale?
• 

  AlphaMan

  Yes, we stick to lynching, shooting, beating, bombing federal buildings...things like that. Hardly ever throw stones at others in western culture. so true.

  .

  And where is this stuff happening? Who are the "we" doing it? A Federal buiding was bombed in OK City, USA back in 1995. Are these things being done by a religious group apart from Islam?
• 

  Qcmbr

  lisa fails - again- to see that culture causes differences in behaviour. Modern day lynching was a (mostly) white, cultural evil that sprung up in America when the recourse to institutional legal application of law was inconsistent and people took matters into their own hands. It took a long time to stamp out but it was done. It was never a religious teaching , it was not to be found in the bible and it was never a legal policy, instead it was a white , supremacist practise. In stark contrast we find Islam practising stoning as an institutional punishment - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rajm.